subjective truth is subjective. objective truth is not subjective.
chocolate is good. this statement is subjective.
2+2=4 this is objective, but true.
if you jump off a cliff, at less than escape velocity, you will fall toward the center of gravity. this statement is objective, but true.
belief does not change objective reality into subjective truth.
here is an experiment to try, put an apple on the table in front of you. now, with only the power of your mind, turn the apple into an orange. if you are successful, tell me how you did it. i haven't figured it out yet.
With all due respect, the example you give, 2+2=4 as being true, is subjective, meaning it's context dependent. What you described as being true is just a decimal math operation. A binary operation with the similar components will give a different result.
1+1=2 in decimal, but 1+1=10 in binary.
Everything is context dependent.The truth changes based on your point of seeing.
What I agree with, though, is that belief - alone - does not change the perceived reality. There is an inherent inertia in the continuum we live in. And you cannot change - at least at our level of understanding - apples into oranges, like instantly. But you can alter your reality, it just takes time.
You cannot plant tomatoes and expect carrots, that's also true. But you can change the perceived reality by planting tomatoes, and, sooner or later, you will get tomatoes, that is certain.
was there some doubt that i intended a base 10 context? deliberate misinterpretation does not change objective truth.
in base 10, 2+2=4 today, tomorrow, or thirty thousand years from now.
if you say, i weigh 300 lbs in a gravity field of 9.8m/s/s. this is time dependent, as tomorrow with gain or loss of mass, the weight will change, but objective truth is still objective, and is not subjective.
I can agree to disagree. Maybe this will clear the confusion related to "objective reality", which is nothing but an assumed perspective, voluntarily promoted to the absolute level of truth:
You should know why you believe 2+2=4. If the reason why you believe it ceases to be valid, you should be ready to change your belief. In other words, I can imagine observations which would convince me that 2+2=3 (for more details refer to http://lesswrong.com/lw/jr/how_to_convince_me_that_2_2_3/)
You can never be 100% sure of something because that would take away from you the possibility of ever updating your beliefs if new evidence comes. And rationality is about creating beliefs based on evidence.
there is a difference between observationally dependent perspective, and belief dependent perspective. beliefs can be altered independent of objective reality. observations are derived from objective reality and are dependent on the ability to perceive enough of the aspects of objective reality in order to comprehend it.
I enjoy this conversation / debate :). But still, I agree to disagree. There is no objective reality. What we call "objective reality" is a highly personal, virtual reality created second by second, based on what we previously experienced (observations and beliefs are both emerged from experiences).
If we talk about "objectively seeing" something, then what about blind people? Do they not experience an objective reality? There is this amazing talk on Ted, given by a very interesting person (I won't spoil it, maybe you didn't see it). It's worth 15 minutes of your life, methinks :)
http://www.ted.com/talks/isaac_lidsky_what_reality_are_you_creating_for_yourself#t-605150
i enjoy this conversation because it allows me to refine my ability to explain this even to myself. for almost two decades i was a staunch advocate for all of the arguments made by Mr Lidsky. i looked for every explanation that would bolster my supply of proof. from brain science, psychology and optics to quantum mechanics, even linguistics, i had all of my angles covered. the subjective is admittedly a huge part of individual perception. i think most people do not appreciate how much of what we experience is made up by our brains, but there are still events that exist outside of our ability to create them. nuclear radiation, cosmic rays, inertial and gravitational effects, force gradients, chemical pressure waves, more things than i can name here, anything that exists outside of even our unconscious perception, these and more can be measured independently, with equipment external to our nervous system, by anyone who can view the readout. this can be adapted to braille, just as there are braille computer monitors. all of scientific knowledge takes advantage of repeatability. if everything is subjective, repeatability from person to person is impossible. instruments that repeatably measure conditions, that can be used by more than one person, one time, which is what repeatability is, this is dependent on our interaction with objective reality.
this is similar to reading a book. if two sighted people read the same book, that is not altered between readings, the words remain the same. the meaning may be vastly different from one person to the next, but the book remains. even if the second person is not literate, the book remains. objective reality exists, our perception and comprehension are what diverge from one person to the next, and/or from one time to the next. objectivity is to be found in the repeatable and external.
I think I understand your point of view. I will, once more, choose to gracefully disagree.
The basis of my disagreement is change. Everything changes. Repeatability doesn't exist, it's an illusion we create by our ability to discern what is different and what is equal. Two seconds are both equal and different. They are different in that one is "older" than the other, but they are equal in terms of the "slice" of time that we agree they represent (time is relative, you know that). So two seconds are not truly "repeating" one another.
Change is all pervasive, the person you were 5 minutes ago, when you wrote your comment is different from the person you are right now, reading my comment. We impute a concept of "me" on top of this continuous change, on top of this observer of phenomena and we cling to it. And we grow a cognitive system on top of this clinging of "me". Eventually, this system is the one that creates the lack of happiness and fulfillment we experience.
It's a very difficult pill to swallow, I know, because it creates even more confusion. Which, to an extent, is true: there's no real meaning in this world or in this life. We create that meaning by fear of non-existence.
Hey, maths is the only dependable thing in the universe; your argument would make many dead Greek people cry!
An object plus a similar object gives double the original object or 2 in decimal = 10 in binary, every single time. You were arguing semantics.
Dead Greeks wailing-stop it!