I read an article recently of a survey they did in swedish schools where most kids were using AI to "help" with their homework. According to the article 54% of the 1000 students between the ages 15 to 24 they had asked said that they've used AI in a way they don't think is allowed. Whereas 40% said they weren't sure if there's any rules against using AI, 33% said there are rules and 27% thought there weren't any.
Needless to say it made me think about the situation here on Hive but this post isn't going to be about that. I do have to say, though, that curators in my opinion have gone through great lengths in the history of the chain to reward effort, even if grammar and spelling hasn't been perfect and even if many have just been okay with an english automated translation as long as there was trust that the original language post was original. I guess it says a lot about those who keep threading the needle between using AI to improve their grammar/language or to avoid placing as much effort as others into the content. Up to you to decide if it's worth the risk long-term.
Anyway, the reddit post in r/sweden talked about how past generation used to cheat as well, if it's possible, people will find a way. Some mentioned how they used to find places on the early days of the internet with essays and other writings of things you'd normally get to work on in schools and are supposed to research and write them down in your own words to hand in and that it some times became awkward when several students had written about the same thing and most of it was word for word copy between all of them. I remember of such pages existing but at that time it was already so well known we figured the teachers were well aware of them and would find out easily, even when just rewriting/wording/adding typo's, something that may still exist on Hive here and there and often something newcomers find themselves doing.
Anyway, without making this post about that, the real reason I started writing it was to share a story of my time in college. It was quite a small school with only about 30 students in the same year, maybe 80 students in total in the whole college. Which makes what we noticed kind of weirder. In our first year we had exams coming up and everyone was pretty stressed about them cause it was the first ones of the first semester and I guess everyone wanted to make a good first impression towards the teachers as it may affect their future grades. Somehow one of the students mentioned that an older one he was friends with had told him to just read through his exam of that semester when he was in the same year and that the teachers barely ever changed them. I can't remember exactly if it was a friend of his of the second year or third as it could be the teachers would switch them up every other year but that there was definitely a pattern where they wouldn't create new exams each year but re-use old ones over and over. Whether it was due to laziness or what is unsure but this quickly became the default of what students would do. I think they would grab a copy of both 2nd and 3rd years exams of the first year and it would quickly get copied over to anyone who wanted one.
Exam time and what do you know, it's the exact same questions as the copy we had been learning by heart. Most students aced it with many giving answers exactly the same to the dot. Teachers didn't think much of it because for many of the questions it was quite straight forward answers I guess, this was also something that bothered me with the way college worked in my opinion. Students learned more how to cram for the exams at highest efficiency than to actually learn and get a deeper knowledge or interest of the subject. This was evident when we'd pick up Biology again the next year for instance and a majority had forgotten close to everything they had learned the first year when the teachers did a quick recap to check what the students remembered. Before we get there though, something happened already in the first year.
Someone had snitched. No one knew who but suspicions existed and it created kind of a dislike over some students even without proof or proof ever coming to light. The way we found out someone had snitched was cause the exams all across the board were suddenly completely new, by that I mean all subjects and from all teachers, fresh exams with new questions. If I could pay 10k Hive today to have security footage of the students in that class that day as they went through the questions to see their faces, I'd probably easily pay up. I remember the shock and horror in some of them while me and some others would just smile about it knowing it was inevitable eventually. Don't get me wrong, I wasn't smiling cause I had crammed for this exam either way, I'm pretty sure I barely passed it cause at the time I wasn't focusing too much on my grades for reasons I'm not going to get into in this post. It was kind of funny, though, how a majority of students, all working together to cheat were caught red-handed simultaneously.
The day of the results arrived and as expected, the average score dropped harder than the crypto markets after bankman-frind ftx'd it up. There were some 6's, or what you guys would call F's as well while some had done pretty good, which is what raised suspicions of the snitches even more, especially when some of them weren't naturally "smart" like a couple students in our class everyone just knew and agreed had photographic memory-style smartness. The weird thing was that the teachers never brought it up, they said something along the lines of "guess you all had an off-day, huh" and everyone just moved on while adapting to the changes. It's as if the teachers knew they had some fault in it all by never changing the questions and re-using the same couple exams year after year so they kind of just hoped everyone would move on and forget about it.
Anyway, come second year things were kind of back to normal and many of us would look back and think about our collective decision to just go the easy way and how compared to cramming for exams was even worse because it meant we had learned even less than we should have. Some were even interested in the subjects and actually read up on everything and did their homework but obviously didn't wanna get a lower score than others with the cheatsheet so they got themselves one too. Was kind of a weird time in general. I guess people will most often choose the easy way out, especially when "mob mentality" hits it takes a lot for the few who didn't fall for the peer pressure to stand by it but I think they all got a lot of respect by the others and obviously did way better in the upcoming exams since they remembered things from the first year.
Going back to Hive, I think it's important that the stance we've taken against AI, reworded content and all this other low effort things like buying votes I'm seeing slowly but surely start up again. It's important cause people like to compare on Hive, we hear it often and it's one of the main "weapons" people like to use if they ever get downvoted, "ye well why aren't you downvoting this similar account/content/abuse?!", which means if they see some kind of "bad" activity or "cheating" go unnoticed/unhandled they may copy the activity.
Anyway, just a random share from a past memory. Thanks for reading.
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I work in education and I am a firm believer that all test should be open book. When I am in the real world and I don't understand something I Google it. That's an essential skill these days. Why not teach kids how to effectively find and use reliable sources on the Internet instead of having them waste their time memorizing stuff they won't care about or need five years from now.
Yeah it definitely needs to be reworked, let them use Google and make the questions in ways where you need to figure out the answer like using a calculator in math exams but instead with books and Google.
For sure, I would even make there be some red herrings in there.
100%! Give the right resources and let the student figure it out.
How to use google should be a class! Not everybody knows how to search....
I'd be out of a job if they did!
True, every generation something new always seem to come up and humans will try to adapt to the new norm. Unfortunately in this case, we're fast adapting to what I would call the misuse of AI.
Ordinarily AI should've been something fun for everyone to use. We currently have a generation that finds it difficult to read anything and sadly AI is just the new tool helping them do it efficiently.
You compare hive with exam cheating in an impressive way but what if teacher give a question from previous curriculum and question is just conceptual to know how many students still Remember the previous lessons 😃
They kind of did this yeah, aside from the recap they entered some questions of subjects we hadn't gone through that semester I guess to reward those who hadn't straight up just cheated in the previous one or just crammed for the exam but not really learned it, you know, short term memory cramming where you forget everything a few days later cause you read on it just a few days in advance.
I know some teachers love to do this with students and examine them in different ways but poor student with short term memory always failed in such quiz or questions and they're like huhh ahh ugh......
So you studied biology, huh? As an amateur biologist and lover of that science, I love it because it's my niche. And if you see strange things around here in Hive, like people writing out of focus, I'm sure there are many collecting rewards thanks to AI because it makes their lives easier, according to them. But I'm sure they will be caught at some point, because even the best monkey drops its bananas and fraudsters always get too confident sooner or later.
I don't know what kind of lazy people we'll have with this artificial intelligence that's making life easy for kids.
Anyway, that's just how people are, so let's continue. I used a translator to translate this because otherwise you wouldn't understand my broken English.
Best regards.
That must have been a pretty funny moment when everyone realized they didn't have any of the answers lol.
Your story reminded me of my last year in the university where lecturers repeated exact questions, this doesn't help students. A lot of us can't even ready long posts anymore, AI is actually making things easy which is good but it's making some lazy as people no longer want to use their brains or do proper research... beautiful post
Funny, just last night I started drafting out a very similar post about Japanese students using ChatGPT to do their homework and how the teachers are panicked about what to do. I'm not sure what I really want to say, so it might remain in my drafts folder for awhile.
But yeah, we cheated too. In grade school it was passing notes, writing answers on our body, or something similar. In university I remember all the bookshops sold prewritten essays, previous tests for every class (as it seemed like most profs at our school were similar to yours and didn't change the tests much from year to year or followed a pattern we had all figured out), and similar things. I'm still not sure how that was allowed.
This is the problem with the current school system. In the US and Japan it is just memorize for the test and then forget after the test. There is no learning. Something definitely needs to change. Hopefully this current ChatGPT problem will provoke the schools to finally change.
It's quite amusing how the topic of AI usage has surfaced in a recent townhall session at work, sparking a significant debate about its permissibility 😅
One intriguing point raised was whether, when employing tools like ChatGPT, we should acknowledge their use at the end of a presentation. The counterargument was likening it to using a Calculator for work or Grammarly for grammatical checks in official emails; in such cases, would they also require citation?
As long as these AI tools are considered aids in enhancing our work rather than substitutes for our work entirely, I believe it's justifiable, much like the example you mentioned regarding automated English translation.
My biggest problem with AI is the threat it poses to job security. It won’t be long until AI would replace many of the tasks that I do. We will find ways to adapt but for some. Maybe even myself it would be too late or too difficult to adjust to look for a new career.
Holy sh**. We were 120 in the class and teachers came with 120 different topics to most exams. So basically each of us had a different topic to write about, so cheating was out of the question unless you had the book with you. It was the toughest and most hated university for this. There were two professors who's been kicked out of a couple of universities for being this strict.
I've never had an easy pass, failed a good few exams, had to retake them and so on. Was a tough lesson but did not mind.
Unfortunately education is not what it used to be and not in a good way.
As about cheating on Hive, I could write a book about reasons and outcomes. Long story short, shortcuts may work short term but who does the work has the gains too.
I'm still worrying about AI detection.
https://arxiv.org/abs/2304.02819
Cheating is a work. Like being a scammer.
I once tried to cheat at the high school, on an Hiistory of Italian Narrative test that was just a bunch of tales to read and study and got busted. I remember that I cried.
I was far above the average but I simply barely stand literature and history. I somehow liked philosophy as after knowing some bases it was a great work of improvisation.
Cheating is against ourselves but I would add an exception. Sometimes, the test/exams/checkpoints to pass are too hard if compared to the final result. And therefore, I am not totally against cheating. But it has to be done in a long-sight term as too much cheating would avoid the creation of decent basis to build a future on (and even worse, becoming blackmailable)
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Hahaha I think we all have tales from our school days like that. I suppose I enjoyed most of my school subjects enough to study for the exams, but I remember that in University I bunked a few days and the day I returned we had a freaking spot test. I hadn't been there so didn't even know about it. Internally I panicked but it turned out that it was a re-test because so many of the students had failed the first one a week before so they had the opportunity to re-write. I had got 78% in the previous one so I didn't have to re-write it but I didn't know, so I did. Got an extra 3% so it was fine, but it scared the shit out of me. I didn't bunk a day after that 🤣
I don't agree with a lot of the way that the education system works and the whole parrot fashion way of learning I think is outdated. AI is not going to help at all, it's just going to make things worse. The fact that students don't even know if it's allowed or not shows that they have lack the critical thinking to even question the morality.