You are viewing a single comment's thread from:

RE: Marx , bureaucracy, and the parasitic nihilist.

in #deepdives4 years ago

Maybe you haven't read Marx's work. Maybe you haven't studied his thoughts. Marx was quite an anarchist even though he didn't get along with the anarchists of his time and was too focused on party politics which was a mistake to me, but he had hope that the bureaucratic and military state would dissolve eventually under communism. Of course he was wrong because authoritarian monsters always avoided losing power. Any humans given some power become authoritative, or at least that is what it looks like through history.

Your ignorance about this is quite common from libertarian dogmatic people. This is what you are taught. Communism bad, evil, wrong, crap, whatever. But your critiques actually have intersections with communism. The most important one is the disapproval of parasites in society. For communism, the parasites are the capitalists. People that inherited wealth, people that take the value generated by others and increase their wealth by such exploitation.

So to you the parasites are only in the government and it seems that banks too. However, communists note this parasitic behavior in rich people who don't produce anything but just take advantage of the work of others.

So, yeah, I see how government can be parasitic, I see it in the country where I live. I also disapprove banks role of monopolizing debt and money. And I also disapprove any person that profits from the work of others. This last one is the only thing you don't mention in your text.

Part of the dogma you've been teached is that capitalism has worked wherever it has been seen. But I don't think you have any evidence on such claim. Never mind, that is just part of the "capitalism good, communism bad" dogma.

Definitely, soviet communism, chinese communism, cuban communism have failed in many aspects. I don't think that needs to be debated at all. I think every human systems is alwasy failing and it seems like we are just discovering that. And there is also dogma in some communist people, mostly about having hope on the figure of the state and also thinking the basic claim that "communism good, capitalism bad". It is very similar.

Sort:  

The most important one is the disapproval of parasites in society. For communism, the parasites are the capitalists.

Karl marx's life was one of parasitism, so I guess he knows the subject well, unlike his understanding of the human being.

Free exchange (capitalism) is not parasitism, it's voluntary exchange.

And I also disapprove any person that profits from the work of others.

This is a natural dynamic found throughout the natural world, not just humans.
'Disapproving' about natural systems, says a lot....

I always wonder, when discussing with libertarian and fascists, if they are shitposting.

Natural systems and nature are also very popular concepts among far right. It calls for some sort of darwinist, malthusian thought. Nature becomes essence and pureness and whatever you want to defend from deviation and unnatural evils.

But, let's go along with that.

Nature is definitely not capitalist. Animals dont colect rent, they don't exploit other animals. Yeah, they may eat each other some times, but other times, they collaborate and exchange value in a mutualist way. I can see you actually think capitalism as some sort of mutualism. It would be great if it was that way but the more money a person accumulates, the more power they have.

Humans are part of natural systems. Actually when we forget that, we suffer a lot. Let's say, we build our houses where rivers grow when it rains a lot and eventually our house will flood. If we extract lots of carbon from the ground and burn it, the earth system will slightly change and we will suffer a lot. We are actually kind of worthless if you look at the natural system at planet scale. Humans do deviate or forget this connectedness with other non human systems. I wouldn't use nature essence as an argument in favor of communism of capitalism as it doesn't make much sense.

Capitalism, as Marx puts it, (his concept of capitalism is kind of outdated but the following is a general way to understand it) is buying stuff or services to resell them and make profit from that. Business owners buy labor and sell the product of labor taking from that value exchange. So when make money by reselling without adding value, you are stealing, according to Marx. That's the whole critique to capitalism. And it does not come from exclusively from Marx but from many thinkers in that time. Marx is kind of the scape goat. Natural systems don't have that, they don't even have money. Capitalism is a large deviation from (let's not say natural) non-human systems and you can easily see that in the most wealthy countries that have large cities with great comfort that usually taken as examples of capitalism success (say USA), away from non human systems.

Loading...