" call things what they are don't redefine definitions to fit your logic"
That's ironic because private property was actually first defined by marxism, you just changed the definition to fit your capitalist needs
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well I'm all out of capital to call myself a capitalist. I know that everybody is guilty of wanting things to be different, it's interesting to know at what cost, all I'm saying is that when stuff gets redefined to fit some other purpose, people get killed in the process because they no longer fit, yeah people like stuff, but I don't like killing. I'd like to have a conversation and consensus where possible. or I think I would like to, I don't know myself well in extremes.
"people get killed in the process because they no longer fit"
actually the old property owners in the ussr got off very light, until they burned crops and salted land worsening a natural famine until it became one of the worst in history. (They did this because stalin wouldn't let them hoard grain to make money off of starving cities paying a premium.)
I wasn't there I'm a bit biased from the stories of Ayn Rand that I've payed minor attention to, I'm not well acquainted with why and what the reasons and the happenings were around Soviet Russia.
even today, in capitalist russia, stalin is considered one of the best leaders in history. Even after major reforms, 80% of people voted to keep russia communist, only the rich had gotten a foothold. (but capitalism is freedom right?)That's what happens when you try to be nice to them, they come back and destroy the lives of hundreds of millions of people.
ayn rand and non-violence?
Here is a nice book showing how capitalism will always lead to imperialism, with historical data.
https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1916/imp-hsc/
oh and here is some nice reading about the USSR
http://writetorebel.com/2016/12/16/popular-support-for-the-soviet-union/
http://writetorebel.com/2016/11/25/the-successes-of-socialism-in-the-ussr/
http://writetorebel.com/2016/11/13/socialism-and-democracy-in-the-ussr/
"but I don't like killing" too bad killing is the only way to keep capitalism in place
"I'd like to have a conversation and consensus where possible"
How about the workers democratically controlling the means of production, which are collective property not controlled by any one person?
oh wait sorry that's communism.
well I don't benefit from capitalism, I'm not all for it. I said I'm not well versed in systems of governance or economic models, communism is a mixed bunch of both, it's not democratic, when it was implemented it was dictatorial for the most part, the one party rule isn't really democratic. A democratic control of the means of production by the workers would be democracy or a form of anarchy if there is no state, but then what would keep workers together, when they are free to wander off and on,
well I'm off to read again :|
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workers%27_self-management
"Part of a series on Socialism, Syndicalism, Anarchism"
Venus Project much?
I'm not into technocracy either. Something they said about no emotions in their last movie, always saving the best for last, thank god I grew up :D
Talking about many definitions, if I follow all the links to the right I will be left with white hairs :D
"ut then what would keep workers together, when they are free to wander off and on"
https://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/peter-gelderloos-anarchy-works
markets have existed under socialism, but when given the choice workers almost always choose to forgo them. What would keep the workers together? There want to be together, humans are social and enjoy helping each other. You can see that in every country the gov collapses in anarchist communism is the outcome. (well except for like 3 mutualist ones, but nobody cares about those)
"Something they said about no emotions in their last movie"
there is no reason to do anything without emotions, yet again it is not a good branch of socialism
so I'm going to stop reading here "it's not democratic"
Communism literally can not exist without democracy.
to quote one of the most influential socialists in history (killed by capitalists while trying to use non-violence to turn a country socialist mind you)
I will read what you have linked when I regain some strength, thanks for the conversation :) as I said I'm not well read on politics and economics that hasn't been in my interest. It's a really big topic that got a lot of attention. Nice blog too I hope we can continue the conversation and I thank you for sharing. we might have differences, but I for one like learning I hope you do too.
"Venus Project much?"
it was based off an older branch of Utopian socialism, scientific socialism is better.
well they turned pretty scientific and I drifted away. Had most of your arguments and as I said no emotion trumped that, I was expecting it halfway through.
You,re so cool!
all I'm saying is that you want to play the same game, but want to have the rules in your favor like anybody else you are so much against. tell me why you can't make a company based on the virtues of communism, I bet you 50 hammers you can get 50 people willing to try it out.
oh here is a video of why "communist companies" can't work under capitalism. Turns out you just don't understand captialism, who would've thought
"White blood cells not being able to out-compete cancer cells doesn't show that cancer cells are better, only that they are better at spreading like a virus."
again the last quote bugs me, cancer isn't taken you know just as profits in this day and age are created and exploitative, both are true, fiat money don't have much value.
now onto the video, yes "house always wins"~1min
some lots o' ffffffffffffffffffffff
after the third minute it's ok I suppose.
I agree with most of the second half there. It's a scratch my back I scratch yours system I know.
You,re so cool!
" tell me why you can't make a company based on the virtues of communism"
because a company making profit off of the workers will always have enough power to crush it.
It can only be a society. Again, those are almost always crushed by the far more massive capitalist countries. They are literally bombed to death, or destroyed through embargoes. Just look at cuba, only 350+ assassination attempts on the leader, by the United States.
"why don't you try to help jews in nazi germany"
fair point there.
well just that last part I don't agree with and well turns out I'm almost right, 42% of the holocaust deaths were from the various european jews(24 polish, 8 soviet), on the other hand we have 20% soviet prisoners, 10% politicals (..no worries) 22% ukrainians+belarrussians+ethnic poles, well
here is a great video, I'd advise you to watch it.
https://www.ted.com/talks/ben_dunlap_talks_about_a_passionate_life
it's not political, rather historical. Here is an example that is hard to repeat. I can only aspire to even be close to such a happening. I have to say it gets me every time.
You,re so cool!