I spent the afternoon with Smallsteps, who now comes directly home from school rather than going to afternoon care, so she has time to burn. I don't want her to get accustomed to me entertaining her each day, so gave her the option of playing after doing her homework, or helping me clean the fridge after I had finished writing. She played while I wrote and then she helped wash the shelves of the fridge in the sink, whilst I was sorting through and reorganising contents.
We had a good discussion during the is time about learning and how everything is essentially patterns, where some kind of series leads to an outcome. She doesn't quite understand the concept of mathematical formulas enough, so the pattern analogy worked. So, for example, when she reads, she first learns the possible letters in the alphabet and then how they work together. From there, each word is just a pattern made from those pieces. Similarly, we talked about music, how each song is made from the same notes, but depending on the timing and order, the pattern changes, and a different song is made.
We looked at some other examples, like building a house, where the foundation part of the pattern is like an alphabet, where it is required to build upon. Or the patterns of using cutlery correctly to eat, where once the patterns are practiced, they become habitual and thoughtless. All of what we do is formulaic. Even if we don't know or understand the formula being used.
A little later, this conversation came to mind.
This isn't for the benefits of the users.
However, I think that a place like Facebook (I am not a user) shouldn't be the guardians of truth for two billion people. And, we have seen how many times that in hindsight, the social platforms got it very wrong, because "fact" was whatever the government decided was fact, and fallacy was anything the government disagreed with.
But, the stated reason for getting rid of the fact checkers is that they are biased, and there are an increasing number of errors. This is caused by many reasons, which will also include the explosion of AI content and AI automation for the checking itself, as the pool of information on what is fact and fiction, is increasingly muddy. Not only this, regardless of whether something is fact or not, we live in an age where the truth is whatever you believe it to be, to the point where a man can beat a woman up, and win a medal for it, as a woman.
The thing is that just like gender, fact and fiction are not binary these days, they are on a spectrum, and truth is dictated by perspective and opinion. Not only this, information is no longer taken as living in an ecosystem with interdependencies and nuances. Rather, each individual sees that there is a black and white right and wrong and expects that their personal viewpoint on every topic, is respected wherever they go and in whatever they consume, even if they are not the target market of the content.
As you can imagine, this is a nightmare for a platform to moderate for acceptable facts.
But, by giving up fact-checking and pushing it to the community, they can "wash their hands" of the liability, and can instead push blame and due diligence to the users. That sounds like a good thing and maybe it is, but as we know, users are overconfident and lazy idiots, who are driven by desire and greed - because we are human. We aren't going to do our own fact checking, and they know that. This means their volume of created content can go up unverified, cost of policing go down, and their ad revenue model make more - maximizing profits a bit further.
And of course, another reason to no longer censor, is to provide a platform for any kind of political discourse, which again sounds good, but actually just empowers the outspoken minority to get increasingly more vocal, and vitriolic. Leaving it up to the community to moderate, makes it a place for fighting and point scoring, not discussion and debate.
There are patterns in play.
The part of the formula we need to remember when it comes to corporate platforms, is that every decision they make is in service to increasing or defending profits. If the best way to do this is also in the best interest of the user, they don't mind, but it so rarely is. All this move is, is more political manoeuvring to take advantage of the changing information landscape, where "fake news" is all the news, and fact and truth is no longer verifiable. Facebook don't want to police it, because it is a winless situation in modern society. We say we want the truth, but even if we do, that is no guarantee we will accept it as such anyway.
I don't care what the centralised platforms do with their content, but what it will do is further distort information and erode trust, which means that at some point, people might actually be willing to build and use systems they can trust. No centralised information can be trusted, because there is just too much incentive to skew the message, especially when the algorithms doing the checks and distributing those messages, are designed to maximise profit.
Eventually, my daughter is likely to end up at least trying many of these platforms, but I am not going to send her in blind. Instead, she is going to have the foundation to read and understand the patterns she is seeing, and at least have a chance to consume with discernment, rather than naïveté. One thing we need to recognise is, that there is far too much we don't know, to be too confident in what we think we do know.
That is a fact.
Taraz
[ Gen1: Hive ]
Well a big chunk of the reason I jumped on here was precisely because there was supposed to be no censorship.
Ahh I remember when my kids were that helpful XD
then I got a lot of help from my well meaning outlaws whom I asked to come and babysit/spend some time with the kids while I was working from home when they were younger but for whatever reason they decided they were going to come over and clean instead and kept sitting the kids down in front of the tv instead of letting them help because "we just want to get it done" and don't get me wrong I'm grateful for the cleaning help as I always struggle with that but the kids going through a period of being resentful and angry about the fact they have to clean/do chores was a hard one to fix
They are actually helpful.
they grew up and will at least do their chores and stuff but I still have to mental load for everyone which irks me no end because I'm not really any better at keeping on top of anything
I've had many similar conversations with middle child especially as she's the one on social media the most. It got to a point where "messing up the algorithms" is a joke ("bro watching this video really messed up my recommendations" or in my case "Spotify didn't have a clue before and has even less of a clue now") and she readily admits to being super easily influenced "I saw this ad for doughnuts and NOW I REALLY WANT DOUGHNUTS" "damn you're easily manipulated" "I KNOW" (not quite how the conversation went but that was the gist of it, and she made doughnuts in the air fryer).
My kids and their friends are all at the age where this is a problem, perhaps on a different tangent to what you were writing about. They know a hell of a lot about marketing and other manipulative tactics, but may think that they know so much more about it than they actually do and thus may not realise when they are falling for something that they've missed because they think they know everything there is to know about it.
Hell we're probably at that age where this is a problem but hopefully we at least recognise it x_x
I know some adults who never became helpful.
Do you see yourself in your daughter at that age, or was it just different for us back then, without this level of digital manipulation?
For every one they catch, 20 techniques slip through their mesh. It is like a magicians trick, showing the "trick" to draw attention, whilst the real thing is happening out of sight.
Our mind discerns patterns. When it has words to describe a pattern, we call that logic. When it lacks the words to describe a pattern it's observed, we call that a 'gut feeling'.
Do you think people on social media are using logic, or gut on normally?
They're just hunting dopamine, for the most part.
I think there is a point where it becomes impossible to determine what is fact and what is fiction. I mean back in the day it was pretty clear because the ludicrous stuff was obvious. These days, nothing shocks me anymore so who knows! Plus even if someone clearly says something like "we are going to change the name of the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of America". People will excuse, reason, or explain it away anyhow.
A long time ago I wrote an article about how all those crazy conspiracy sites with the bad fonts, might be the governments surreptitiously letting out secrets. Then they can say "but we told you all about it!"
That's a good point! Who knows?!
Complex topic- removing fact checkers is actually akin to freedom of speech that we promote on Hive. The main difference being the community here is relative small but mature enough to identify propaganda and fake news and nuke if necessary. Whereas web2.0 community is not possible.
On the other hand, fact checkers for Chinese content on FB are from China, there's no surprise what content gets censored. With my previous homes being in Taiwan and Hong Kong that was even more apparent
The other difference is, there is an incentive to moderate and curate - on Facebook, what is the payoff to police as a non-owner?
The Chinese government censors?? ;D
old platforms really are quite bad. Recently I wanted to edit my post on twitter and found out that to do that I have to pay money? What?? also I saw on youtube a let's play video where creator in the title said that she is a trans girl. I don't understand this need to tell who you are. I don't go around announcing that I am: white, male, not very wealthy , atheist... my favorite colors are blue, green and white. No one asked that and no one cares...
People keep advertising their labels, to try and make themselves feel like they are special, without having to do anything special.
They did not sell the networks only as a means of communication but the great truth is that they manipulate us and use us at will the other day talking to my friend about a lipstick that I bought and all day advertising that brand I do not know how they do it but it gave me some fear.
Word of mouth and social proof is what drives the marketing the most perhaps.
Dang man! Excellent parenting! I love how you take the time to actually explain. She made a great choice with the dishes as a result.
Why does this not freak the f**k out of everyone?! It does me.
if not downright written into law.
OMG right!
I try at least 1-2 times a day to ask my child (10year old girl and 5 year old girl) who wrote that article/tvshow/post, who paid for it, who benefits and why might they want you to listen.
My big girl is slowly learning that because someone says it is true.... it might not be...
we are not conspiracy theorists here... but i very much am aware that someone PAID for the news that we consume... the question there is why and for what reason.
BLINGIT
What makes someone a conspiracy theorist? Is not questioning the narrative a giant step toward conspiracy theory? I get called this whenever I cast doubt on the too-simple stories we are now relentlessly told.
lol... i hear you there. Casting doubt is a sensible thing. Just what i tell my girl to do. Think about the situation. In my mind a conspiracy theorist makes up a fantastical story and believes it fanatically with no evidence.
In my mind a person who i consider a conspiracy theorist, is just someone who hears information, immediately makes up a story behind it and believes their own truth. NOT based on facts.
A sensible person looks at a situation, sees some possible reasons behind it and is open to ideas. makes their own mind based on their own experience and research and doesn't just blindly follow or NOT follow the information.
its totally fine to suggest several reasons behind a situation or fine to suggest how the situation is manipulated, but to take one idea with no evidence and run off on a vendetta would be. :-)
In the end i guess its just a statement?
what are your thoughts?
Anyone can find "evidence" that fits the story they already believe. This evidence is often nothing more than statistics, which is easily manipulated to "show" whatever it is you want to show. Those beliefs are based on "evidence." There are also many who believe what they are told to believe, by a priest or shaman or politician or family member etc. These are beliefs based on faith in an external source. The trick is to be able to recognize, as you are teaching your children, when the evidence might have been tampered with, by whom, and why. I do put my faith in certain entities, trusting that they have done the work, occasionally checking their show notes to see where they got their evidence. If a source does not provide their sources, and those sources are not primary sources, I do not trust their information. It's complicated! Anyone who is obviously biased is not trustworthy imo.
I hear you there.
its good to see there are people that can still think critically and sensibly about situations.
BLINGIT
There are a lot of us here. Do you follow deirdyweirdy? She's one of my favorites.
I have no idea! I think it might, but people who went along with it now don't want to walk back.
Teaching Smallsteps to consume social media content (when she does start to use them) with discernment is a good thing in a world riddled with lies. In a world where, like you said, truth and fallacies are dictated by those in power. One has to be able to filter out the BS. We do certainly need help.
The lies aren't just in the media. People are getting worse and reading body cues and I think this is why so many fall for face to face lies too.
What's more is that recently Meta has announced that they will include AI accounts on facebook and instagram and intermingle them with humans that they can use to manipulate information. Then the humans that can determine AI accounts from real people can easily fall for misinformation.
It get's their numbers up, to manipulate the advertisers into paying more.
Facebook fact checking was completely ineffective against Russian manipulation so good riddance.
All systems can be gamed, and when there is a high incentive to do so, people will always find a way.
Who cares the fact checking on Facebook or Instagram? Facebook adressses to those who are over at age of 50 today, and on Instagram, they care how many followers and likes they get with their account. It has turned into showing off one's body.
I wonder if they will fact check advertisements, or will the site be filled with memecoins?
Facebook has had scandals in the past. It doesn't care about user security or user-side. It is completely focused on how much money it can make.
Money makes the business world go round.
I really hope that the young of this generation who grow up on social media and internet, can learn to differentiate between facts and lies. Otherwise we are doomed and need to shut down Wikipedia 😅
I don't think they can. I think they have given up already and just pretend they know the truth.
Did You see Zuckerdouche announced the FactWreckers exiting on the 4 year anniversary of removing the POTUS from the FecesCrook platform. Planned hypocrisy/irony? You gotta wonder how many million dollar bribe donations and how far these big tech SNAKES will slither up Trumps ass for their get out of jail free (Please don't break up my Monopoly) cards. Gates,(Microsloth Windospybloatware)
BezosBozos (Amazon) Musk (H1-B abuser and GFY face proclamationist) the list of Never Trumpers who are suddenly Forever Trumper Donors goes on and on...