I decided to pursue an academic life when I was young. A Biology University for 4 years, after that Masters and Ph.D. A total of 10 years studying and trying to prepare my CV for that life that I chose. During my University my goal was to study as hard as I could to get a nice transcript with a good record of grades (GPA). Those grades were important to apply for fellowships and internships. If you didn't have a minimum average on your record, you couldn't apply for these fellowships and get money while in an internship. But should an institution reward directly with monetary compensation for a good record?
The short answer is No. It is the interest of the student to keep a good record. The institution recognizes of course already students with a good record with some extra titles in the diploma. A title of academic merit. That can help a lot in your C.V. despite not giving you immediate money back. Now imagine if the institution rewards students with a good GPA. Maybe it would attract lurkers. Yes, the same lurkers that are looking for crypto airdrops. They would attend a random university just focusing on the money back, which shouldn't be the primary focus of someone attending the University. In the end, this student would begin another university just to try another reward.
Another problem is where the reward would come from. The government? the institution? Are they prepared to fund everyone that reaches a good academic record? It is tricky for that. The over-stimulus of generating more diplomas wouldn't solve the work market problem. That already is a problem in the science area. Many people graduate with high qualified diplomas without a place to go. I can count in my hand from my former colleagues that I could find a job in the area of Biology. Of almost 100 people, around 10% could find a job in the Area.
From the 90%, most went to other fields to try money, like commerce or business. Some others went through medicine school to become medical doctors, this is a field that always needs professionals. Why provide money to good students when there isn't a future for them in that career, either because they are there only for the money or because there aren't enough work opportunities waiting for them? So why the universities can't help their students to connect to employers? Creating partnerships with the industry is something that Colleges in Canada do for example. Colleges in Canada aren't the same as universities in the USA. These Colleges provide a technical school of 1 or 2 years. The Colleges have partnerships with the industry where the students in the last year start with a mandatory internship, in which they can have a real contract after graduation.
I would bet that the majority of the University graduates aren't seeking for a monetary reward for their studies, they just want a job that fits their studies background. That is the big depression of the person graduating after 4 years of hard working. You spend 4 years studying to get good grades and after finishing most don't know where to go. Partnerships between industry and universities are needed to allocate more than half of their students at least. It is so bad to see 90% of your colleagues not knowing what to do after getting the hard-deserved diploma.
Decidi seguir uma carreira acadêmica quando era jovem. Uma universidade de Biologia por 4 anos, depois Mestrado e Doutorado. Um total de 10 anos estudando e tentando preparar meu currículo para a vida que escolhi. Durante a universidade, meu objetivo era estudar o máximo possível para obter um bom histórico de notas (GPA). Essas notas eram importantes para se candidatar a bolsas de estudo e estágios. Se você não tivesse uma média mínima no seu histórico, não poderia se candidatar a essas bolsas e ganhar dinheiro durante o estágio. Mas uma instituição deve recompensar diretamente com compensação monetária por um bom histórico?
A resposta curta é não. É do interesse do aluno manter um bom histórico. A instituição reconhece, é claro, os alunos com bom histórico com alguns títulos extras no diploma. Um título de mérito acadêmico. Isso pode ajudar muito no seu currículo, apesar de não dar retorno financeiro imediato. Agora imagine se a instituição recompensasse alunos com bom GPA. Talvez isso atraísse oportunistas. Sim, os mesmos oportunistas que procuram airdrops de criptomoedas. Eles frequentariam uma universidade qualquer apenas focando no dinheiro de volta, o que não deveria ser o foco principal de alguém frequentando a universidade. No final, esse aluno começaria outra universidade apenas para tentar outra recompensa.
Outro problema é de onde viria a recompensa. Do governo? Da instituição? Eles estão preparados para financiar todos que alcançam um bom histórico acadêmico? Isso é complicado. O estímulo excessivo de gerar mais diplomas não resolveria o problema do mercado de trabalho. Isso já é um problema na área de ciências. Muitas pessoas se formam com diplomas altamente qualificados sem um lugar para ir. Posso contar nos dedos dos meus ex-colegas que conseguiram um emprego na área de Biologia. De quase 100 pessoas, cerca de 10% conseguiram um emprego na área.
Dos 90%, a maioria foi para outros campos para tentar ganhar dinheiro, como comércio ou negócios. Alguns outros foram para a escola de medicina para se tornarem médicos, um campo que sempre precisa de profissionais. Por que fornecer dinheiro para bons alunos quando não há futuro para eles nessa carreira, seja porque estão lá apenas pelo dinheiro ou porque não há oportunidades de trabalho suficientes esperando por eles? Então por que as universidades não podem ajudar seus alunos a se conectarem com empregadores? Criar parcerias com a indústria é algo que faculdades no Canadá fazem, por exemplo. Faculdades no Canadá não são as mesmas que universidades nos EUA. Essas faculdades oferecem uma escola técnica de 1 ou 2 anos. As faculdades têm parcerias com a indústria onde os alunos no último ano começam com um estágio obrigatório, no qual podem ter um contrato real após a graduação.
Aposto que a maioria dos graduados universitários não está buscando uma recompensa monetária pelos seus estudos, eles só querem um emprego que se encaixe em seus estudos. Essa é a grande depressão da pessoa que se forma após 4 anos de trabalho árduo. Você passa 4 anos estudando para tirar boas notas e depois de terminar, a maioria não sabe para onde ir. Parcerias entre a indústria e as universidades são necessárias para alocar mais da metade dos seus alunos pelo menos. É tão ruim ver 90% dos seus colegas sem saber o que fazer depois de conseguir o diploma tão merecido.
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Speaking as someone who did get some scholarships to go to University it was very important to me to get that money. Some scholarships were from trusts, some were from industry, some were from the school but all of it was extremely helpful in me graduating from University. As someone who initially had to drop out in second year due to lack of funds I can absolutely say that every little bit helped!
You are right though. University was just a stepping stone towards getting a degree so I could get a job. I really do envy you getting a PhD. One of my professors who eventually ended up becoming the Dean of the Pharmacy department did want me to join her on some research and would have supported me to get my masters and PhD....but I had to decline as I simply didn't have the money to continue. Sure I might have been able to squeak by on a researcher salary while living on campus but it would have been tight and I was up to my neck in student loans.
Looking back I'm sure I would have enjoyed a research job far more than a community Pharmacist job....but that ship sailed long ago.
Having said that I have a friend who got a Masters degree in Marine Biology. Really bright guy...and he is currently working at London Drugs in the computer department and has for at least 20 years. As you said, jobs for some degrees just don't exist. Very much a shame.
scholarships of course are important and help people specially in North America to be in University. I think it is a bit different from what I discussed. the topic is rewarding monetary good students.... I get good grades and receive money as a reward where I can use to anything.
Scholarships is a money that you get to pay off part or totally your studies. Which I totally agree in existing!
In Brazil is a bit different, since most of good Universities are Public. Good grades there gives you a different type of money. Since all labs are Public or at least 95% or plus, when you are into paid interships you are paid by public grants as fellowships. For a student to be able for that , the students need a good GPA. SO it is also a type of reward, but in this case is a type of income. But you are also working to get this income. I don't know if i made clear , it is a weird system ;)
I like to comment everything you say in parts hahaha
Well that is a really normal thing in my area. A friend of mine went through Ph.D. in ornitology (birds and stuff) then he started a technical college in human fertilization .... The Brazilian government just released a new fund to try to bring back Brazilians with Ph.D. from abroad. It is a fellowship (again it isn't a salary) that pays well for 5 years. However, after 5 years what happens? Is there any job opportunity for all of them? Even if the income could be better than my salary now (which is difficult to compare when we deal with cost of living etc) isn't worth.
Again this brings up a very big topic.
Business is where the money is.
Research is important to further humans knowledge and progress as a species but it doesn't necessarily bring in money.
Having people knowledgeable in marine biology, ornithology, primatology or whatever is important to learn about the world around us BUT there aren't the dollars available to support it. Or at least not enough for the majority of people to study.
So, should University be for the rich who can support themselves and advance human knowledge? Is it for those professions which requires more education than is possible than a typical high school can provide? Should it be funded by business that can profit from its advances? Should it be funded by governments for the advancement of all people? Should the best students be "hired" to learn by companies out of high school with a promise of employment at the end so companies can get the best and brightest educated to their needs?
It's a discussion for friends in an evening party....a bit long for a Hive post :(
If you cross the rockies we should meet 🫣
I'm in Edmonton on the 14th but then heading to Saskatoon the next day. Not sure you'd find me interesting in conversation as I'm not a fellow researcher like yourself but if interested I'll pencil in some time to visit Lethbridge (I think that's where you are) sometime when I'm heading out to visit my mom (its a long drive from Vancouver to Saskatchewan--Lethbridge might make a nice stopover 😂)
Wow nice car trip hahaha let me know even if it is just a path ehhehe
hehe...
.... only partial car trip. I live in Abbotsford and the Flair flights are cheaper than gas to drive to either Calgary or Edmonton. How am I supposed to drive the 1150km from Abbotsford to Edmonton for cheaper than $30 (the price of a Flair flight).
Some fun math for a science guy :)
At 1.68/liter (gas price here)... $30/1.68 per liter --> 17.87 liters
1150km == 11.5 x 100
17.87 liters / 11.5 hundreds --> 1.55 l/100km
I can't think of any car that only uses 1.55l/100km. I mean I used to drive a Mirage at 4.5l/100km and thought that was good. Even my electric doesn't get that kind of economy :D
So, next time I fly to Calgary I'll just add a day trip over to Lethbridge (if your free) and say Hello. Then you can tell me all about Brasil...but if you start speaking Portuguese I'll be totally lost 😉
Fico pensando: Se com estudos já é difícil, imagina sem.. É triste ver pessoas que se dedicaram tantos anos de suas vidas por um comhecimento, por uma profissão e depois não conseguirem recuperar o investimento com um trabalho digno.
Vi muito disso ja!!! 4 anos de estudo… e depois se reinventar
Obrigado por promover a comunidade Hive-BR em suas postagens.
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Eu não concordo com isso também não, tipo, dar um premio em dinheiro, grana viva, a ideia é boa se a pessoa tiver uma boa maturidade para lidar com dinheiro, agora se ela so corre atrás de se tornar a melhor da sala por conta do premio, por mais que seja inteligente para conseguir isso, o resultado é mostrado como uma pessoa sem experiencia de vida, de entender que dinheiro ajuda mas não é tudo.
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Parece que todos concordam que não é uma boa coisa a se fazer!
Pelo menos os BRs estão alinhados e cada um deu seus motivos, eu particularmente acho até injusto porque partimos de realidades diferentes, alguns de nós não teriam como alcançar a linha de chegada, simples assim!
!WINE