I reply to you in my hat as a former lawyer.
There are times in life when it is our duty to put aside small quarrels, forget about bureaucracy and formalities and remember the law of nature. What is really at the base of our lives as human beings, the values we want to develop and promote.
Above all man-made law are super-principles, some of which are:
- Man's full ownership of her body,
- Man's responsibility for her life as a sovereign being,
- And the multidimensionality of human existence.
It is clear to me that this debate is endless. I respect your opinion, but stand firm in mine.
Law of nature? How many intentionally caused abortions occur in nature (outside of humans)?
I respect that there are strong differences of opinions on this issue and I don't have a problem discussing them or a problem with others who feel differently than me on the subject in general. Where I have a problem is when people, on either side of the argument, result to personal attacks or mistruths in an attempt to further their argument. In extreme cases (which actually seems to be the norm) someone who is pro-life will accuse those getting or performing abortions of being murderers. On the other hand, those that are pro-choice will spew some nonsense about old men wanting to control women's' bodies as being the primary motivation of the pro-life philosophy. In real life, the vast majority of the time, I find that both of those accusations are extreme mischaracterizations at best.
Similarly, regardless of your opinion on the subject, the Supreme Court didn't ban anything and as a former lawyer I assume that you know that. So why state that they did? Disagreeing with the decision is no reason to misrepresent it.
To your three points above:
I agree 100% with this statement. But when does one gain ownership of one's body? As a corollary, when does the right to life begin? You made a statement about a woman and child knowing when there is the "presence of the consciousness of the soul within the physical body". While I don't discount that possibility I don't accept it as a given for every mother and child either. Biologically speaking, life begins at conception. Speaking in terms of the soul or consciousness, that is a much harder question to answer (or depends on specific faith). I tend to err on the side of life as I believe the right to life is paramount. You can't own your body if you are deprived of it. That doesn't mean I think abortion should be outlawed...I don't think that is the right answer or would accomplish what those that seek to preserve life would hope.
At some level, adults are responsible for their children up to some level of maturity. It does not mean that they can murder them (for example). A woman is certainly responsible for her own body. But is she not also responsible for the child growing inside of her as she would be a child that has been born? Should an adult (man or woman) be able to simply decide that they are no longer responsible or have any obligation, whether before birth or after?
This is a statement that can mean many things and I don't know what relevance it has to the conversation.
I read your articulated comments a few times.
I will leave things as they are, and will not further comment as the main points have been made from both sides, and both you and me have laid out the basic precepts for other readers to make their own discretion on this subject.
Thank you.