I hope you know I respond to you out-of-love hoping that you also can find truth. Please also consult with other wise, true Christians to triangulate whether my responses are truth or flawed.
And they push their (or their church’s) interpretation of scripture onto their indolent and obedient flock
I don't agree, they merely interpret it for us if for example we don't understand certain parts. Also, we are not obliged to believe everything we hear in the church, they will (mostly) not kick us out of it. Read below why it's important.
If you don’t understand certain scriptures, then how are you supposed to know whether what you were told is truth or subversive.
My point is that instead of a designated person (or institution/synagogue) instructing hordes of flock (i.e. centralization), there should be instead decentralized sharing of knowledge. Because we know power via centralization (like flies to honey) corrupts absolutely.
The other problem with centralization is a tendency towards groupthink and becoming swept away by in-group emotional connections instead of reason and superrationality.
Bible study should not be primarily about making cohorts feel good, but instead about rebuke when necessary and utmost focus on truth at any cost. Jesus’ entire point in Matthew 6 is the danger of the ills of socialization on the corruption of the flock. It is as if you have not understand at all what Jesus came to defeat. You (perhaps unwittingly) effectively want to reinstate the Pharisees which crucified Jesus.
The point of Christianity is superrational selflessness to overcome Prisoner’s dilemmas and tragedies-of-the-commons. As soon as you turn it into an emotional power vacuum, then the flies will step right into the vacuum and partake of the honey. Why is that humans can’t understand this? I been trying to explain this to them since 1992 when I at age 26 I walked house-to-house for the Ross Perot campaign speaking to people in their living rooms. I try my best to help people understand Jesus, but people seem to always lose the wisdom and return back to the same ole shit. Depressing.
Seems you are basically joining a church because you like most sheep feel better if the flock moves as a herd. This is precisely what Eric S. Raymond was describing as being the horrific quality of organized religions.
I wrote in my blog:
In the following essay he correctly analyses that humans are not instinctive killers and can only become mass murderers via obedience, statism, corrupted religion, etc. I am confident that he thinks he is also building a case against all religion, but true Christianity does not allow obedience to Earthly kings nor to killing that is not in self-defense. And he holistically misinterprets the Bible yet again, in that Bible is not saying that man is an instinctive killer but rather that man gets himself entwined in obedience and delusion to effect mass murders (the Bible specifically tells us to come out of these facets of the Satan’s Great Harlot). In short humans are always blaming their plight on something and seeking earthly idols, organization, and Nietzsche’s ressentiment (not resentment) instead of true Christianity as taught by Jesus:
Decentralization is a concept that applies even for example to law:
https://www.corbettreport.com/interview-1453-stephan-kinsella-on-law-without-the-state/
We do not need another man to interpret the scripture for each us. We can interpret scripture for ourselves so we are not indoctrinated with the corruption that invariably results when people become indolent and expect to be spoon-fed information like obedient zombies akin to watching television. Mind programming. Propaganda. Lies. Etc.
From the story of Philip and the Ethiopian; Acts 8:30-32:
30 And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?
31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.We actually see how important it is that someone preaches to us. Philip had to go in the middle of nowhere to save that ONE GUY. We need people to preach to us.
It’s so ironic that you cite from Acts 8, because that chapter is about is the wicked statism of King Saul from 1 Samuel 8–15 who the Lord imposed on Israel because they disobey his instruction in 1 Samuel 8 to not have a King rule over them.
The Acts 8:30–31 you’ve cited is actually not a centralized pastor or institution/synagogue indoctrinating a large indolent flock, but rather one wise person responding to the request of another person to help them interpret a specific verse of scripture. The metaphorical lesson here is that decentralization is truth and centralization is wicked. So this reinforces what I am trying to convince you is the truth.
Look at Matthew 16:18 King James Version (KJV)
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
Did He say that he would build a blog or a church?
Again as I explained in my prior comment post, you conflate ‘church’ as a metaphor for a spiritual attitude, demeanor or philosophy with ecclesia.
Let’s draw a distinction between a church and a congregation. Christians could and should congregate to share their ideas about scripture and their love. This means everyone participating and interacting, not some master orating a speech. Maybe some individuals will become respected they often present solid ideas and explanations, but never should they be elevated to a role where the entire congregation just sits there indolent and absorbs a speech.
It is much easier for crowd to listen to one guy explaining a scripture, than free-for-all talking and interrupting.
Our discussion is an example that a back-and-forth is superior to speeches when seeking truth.
If it is confusing, perhaps because your congregation is too large. Decentralize more. Smaller gatherings.
If you caught him in lies or wrong interpretations, just give him heads-up (afterwards) so that he can preach the correct doctrine.
That is not effective nor efficient. No one else in the gathering is informed nor participates.
I do not believe that it's just possible that each and every one of us can just pick up the Bible, hide in the closet and understand every verse clearly.
Please brother do not put words in my mouth that I never spoke. I referred to praying alone, not Bible study alone. I specifically mentioned congregations for groupwise Bible study.
Let's quote the part I believe you refer to:
I’m actually referring to two sections labeled ‘Prayer’ and ‘Fasting’.
This does not seem to condemn churches, but praying in the public just so that you can be seen by others. Church is not only about praying.
You seem to be ignoring my point that Jesus is preaching against the general pitfalls of effects of socialization on humans in spiritual matters.
Also is referring to being true to your superrationality which God can see in your heart and does not need to be validated by others in a group.
So he is implicitly condemning the fact that collectivism is the antithesis of superrationality.
What about 1 Timothy 2 then?
8 I will therefore that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting.
So it seems that we are allowed to pray everywhere together, but prayers are apparently stronger when we pray alone, when it's just us and God.
Once again referring to decentralized interactions.
But the point is, I will need another clear verse that explains how I should not listen to people preach me the Bible.
‘Interaction’ is not the same as indolently and obediently ‘listen’ (as a command) as if you are slave.
And no where did I write that you can not listen to the viewpoint of others you interact with.
It seems to me that Bible promotes preaching to others, assembling and praising the Lord, singing and praying together.
DISAGREE! That is a slippery slope to insane, horrific groupthink outcomes. It is how the fake “Christians” in the U.S.A. for example all got coaxed into thinking that tax deductions from Caesar have anything to with Christianity and maintaining truth.
If you enjoy singing songs with a group and have the ability to separate this feeling from the superrationality, then perhaps it is okay. But I doubt most people can make this emotional separation.
Superrationality entails actually doing something selfless. How is making yourselves feel all warm and fuzzy have anything to do with selfless sacrifice?
What have you accomplished towards superrationality with that emotional backslapping.
Why does Bible talk about "false teachers"? Then every teacher would be false!
Because there are more orders-of-magnitudes more of them than there are truthful teachers.
Christianity is not supposed to be easy. The gate to salvation is narrow and the path to perdition is wide open. If it were easy, then accomplishing it would be not very valuable. Rare things are valuable.
Christianity is not a snowflake.
God’s spirit is present in the church, and God is speaking by the spirit to the churches.
Shudder. 😱 That’s exactly the sort of propensity to mind programming via emotional attachment and cultural manipulation that Eric S. Raymond is citing as the insanity of religion. You’re not helping me by affirming his point.
Apologies, but I am not the author of the Bible.
It’s not the Bible’s fault if you unwittingly get sucked into evil because you refuse to understand. Why do you implicitly blame Jesus?
Christianity has been corrupted since the time of Constantine. Humans can’t seem to wrap their mind around what Jesus said:
Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.” Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’[e]” — Matthew 4 NIV
Jesus explains that truth does not rest its head in what feels good or convenient:
Then a teacher of the law came to him and said, “Teacher, I will follow you wherever you go.” Jesus replied, “Foxes have dens and birds have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head.” — Matthew 8 NIV
Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.” When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?” Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Peter answered him, “We have left everything to follow you! What then will there be for us?” Jesus said to them […] And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife[e] or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life. — Matthew 19 NIV
Jesus explains to walk (possibly alone) from town-to-town with nothing, not even a bag of possessions:
“Do not get any gold or silver or copper to take with you in your belts— no bag for the journey or extra shirt or sandals or a staff, for the worker is worth his keep. Whatever town or village you enter, search there for some worthy person and stay at their house until you leave. As you enter the home, give it your greeting. If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you. If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, leave that home or town and shake the dust off your feet. Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.
“I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves. Be on your guard; you will be handed over to the local councils and be flogged in the synagogues. On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as witnesses to them and to the Gentiles. But when they arrest you, do not worry about what to say or how to say it. At that time you will be given what to say, for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.
“Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. You will be hated by everyone because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved. When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.
“The student is not above the teacher, nor a servant above his master. It is enough for students to be like their teachers, and servants like their masters. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of his household!
“So do not be afraid of them, for there is nothing concealed that will not be disclosed, or hidden that will not be made known. What I tell you in the dark, speak in the daylight; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim from the roofs. Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell. Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground outside your Father’s care.[b] And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. 31 So don’t be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows. — Matthew 10 NIV