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RE: Debunking Calvinism Episode #1—Ephesians 1:1-14

in #religion8 years ago (edited)

Yes you should be very careful. Because given your understanding, the gospel is reduced to anything but good news. They say context is king. Jesus didn't want to have a Damascus road experience when he was walking the earth. That's why he spoke in parables and only drew a few people to himself. But he himself said that once he's lifted up, he will draw all people to himself. John 12:32. But not all who are drawn are going to accept his invitation. This is completely in line with what Paul said about God wanting everyone to be saved and come to the knowledge of truth. You didn't answer my question. Are you saying Jesus contradicts Paul?

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I'm sorry, I thought I did answer. Yes, the Messiah and Paul appear to contradict each other several times in his letters.
Also, it's STILL good news, but from a different perspective then the mainstream claims. He said He must be lifted up as the serpent was in the Wilderness. And the people He will draw to Himself are all of those that are His. Also the invitation to the world is to be "grafted in" to the Bride. Did you respond to my question about The Day of The Lord? that helps to shift perspective.

We can't have contradictions. If you think the scriptures are self-contradictory then you should look for a new religion. I don't think cherry picking from the Bible is the right way of going about seeking the truth.

Cherry picking would be ignoring the rest of the bible in favor of Paul's letters, which the bible itself warns against.

It's not just Paul. Everyone else in the New Testament is preaching the same thing. Your problem is not with Paul. Your problem is with the New Testament.

Again, you only think this because its what we all grew up being told. Our perspective was off from the beginning, which is why it seems like God is so much nicer in the NT than the OT. When you regain perspective, everything fits perfectly, including the coming "Day of the Lord"

You should speak for yourself! I didn't grow up in a Christian family!!I grew up in a Muslim family. ; ))))

Oh, sorry for my general assumption. What made you switch to Christianity, if you don't mind my asking

I still await your description on what happens during The Day of the Lord.

We'll find out in the future. I'm not really obsessed with prophecies and the future. You shouldn't be either especially if you don't believe God wants to save everyone. You could as well be one of those He doesn't wanna save so why bother trying to figure out what the Bible says... If God doesn't want you to understand then you won't, given your worldview unless you think you're smarter than God. This is really the logic behind your worldview. I see no point discussing things further because logically it is pointless.

LOL, you say you arent really obsessed with prophetsy because the events that take place duing the Day of the Lord either confuse or bother you. Yet ealier, you correctly noted that the Hebrews missed the coming of the Messiah becauce they didnt pay attention to the same prophets.
So how do you expect to be able to idintify the "Great Falling Away From the Truth", or the Antichrist? How will you be able to identify the Second Coming? The answer is, you wont. Instead, by ignoring the prophets for a more easy-to-digest version of God, you open yourself to deception so strong, that if possible, it would deceive the very Elect. (notice "Elect" again implies predestination) If you read the prophets and the books of Moses, you will find that the world is in the middle of this very deception. But even this was foretold:
"For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4 They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths."
2 Timothy 3- 4

"I'm not really obsessed with prophecies and the future. You shouldn't be either". Do you imagine this attitude to come from the very God who gave us the prophecies necessary to survive the future? or does line sound more like a stance that a certain Adversary would like us to take?
How could he go about deceiving the whole world, if the whole world was paying attention to prophesy? Lucky for him, people aren't really "obsessed" with prophecies that make up most of the very bible they claim to believe in.

"Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that it shall no more be said, The LORD liveth, that brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt; 15 But, The LORD liveth, that brought up the children of Israel from the land of the north, and from all the lands whither he had driven them: and I will bring them again into their land that I gave unto their fathers.

16 Behold, I will send for many fishers, saith the LORD, and they shall fish them; and after will I send for many hunters, and they shall hunt them from every mountain, and from every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks. 17For mine eyes are upon all their ways: they are not hid from my face, neither is their iniquity hid from mine eyes. 18 And first I will recompense their iniquity and their sin double; because they have defiled my land, they have filled mine inheritance with the carcases of their detestable and abominable things.

19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ends of the earth, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit.

A little prophetic snippet from Jeremiah 16.