RE: Into The Smallest Dimension

[erh.germany]

So nothing you do or say is done or said by your will? If so, then you'd be not responsible for what you think and do?
I do not care if the universe is objective, it matters not when I deal with you right now. I hope, that does not sound offensive, it's meant in a light way.

I will read your other comment tomorrow, for now I say good night.

Comments

[heretickitten]

Do causes not have effects? Does not every action have an equal, but opposite reaction?
Does energy not take the path of least resistance? I can see no true reason why free will in the non-deterministic sense exists. It would be nice if it did, but on an objective level, I don't see free will in the philosophical sense to be an actual objective fact.

However, does this change anything regarding thoughts, words, and actions? From my experience, no, because no matter if effects can defy their causes or not, I still do as I do and you do as you do.

[erh.germany]

What are objective facts?
What we think we know, we can only formulate through language. Language, by its very nature, is influenced by the culture within which each person grows up. Objectivity would involve an observer who is detached from subjective influences. Since there cannot be such an observer, objectivity cannot be practised, only assumed.

"I consider the whole idea of objectivity to be a stumbling-block, a foot-trap, a semantic trick to confuse the speakers and the listeners and the whole discussion, right from the start. For objectivity, after all, as far as I understand Helmholtz's formulation, requires the locus observandi. There the observer must strip off all his personal characteristics and must see quite objectively - locus observandi! - see it as it is. And this assumption already contains fearful errors. For when the observer strips off all his characteristics, namely language - Greek, Latin, Turkic, whatever - when he puts away his cultural glasses and is thus blind and mute, then he cannot be an observer, and he cannot narrate anything at all. The preconditions of his narration are taken away. To ascend to the locus observandi means: put aside all your personal qualities, including seeing, including speaking, including culture, including nursery, and now report something to us. Well, what is he supposed to report? He can't do that."

Heinz von Förster

I wrote an article about him here. Maybe you are interested to read it. He was quite an interesting personality. I also touch the subject of free will.

However, does this change anything regarding thoughts, words, and actions? From my experience, no, because no matter if effects can defy their causes or not, I still do as I do and you do as you do.

Can I take this as a "yes" answer that what you do and think is your responsibility?

[heretickitten]

I think that the natural state of reality is determinism, and the X factor is life. But I do not have extremely clear evidence that life at this point in time is capable of true free-will. But nonetheless, as individual lifeforms, we should assume free-will, and always take full responsibility for everything we do. And the more responsibility we take for the choices we make, the closer we get to defying determinism.

And yes, I certainly wish to find a way to defy determinism. That would likely be the goal of life, because the final number of reality is Zero. Heat-death of the universe.

But if we could change that number to One or Infinity, by any means, then we should do that. Free-will is something that cannot be "natural" to the universe. It must be FORCED, using something that might make scientists, religious people, philosophers, and everyone else scream in fear and horror if attempted.

I would never assume that it would be easy to establish true free-will. I also do not expect people to desire it, if presented to them on a platter. What I see now is merely "will", or worse, enslaved people who work each day and obey their superiors, exist with very little power, and essentially are bound by the context of their lives, and further bound by their inevitable death.

To modify reality and change what is false, to your own chosen truth, could dismantle determinism. Perhaps you'd need some sort of machine to do that. A very powerful computer? Or maybe your own brain can do that. Maybe your genetic code.

Or maybe not.

I'll just have to see and continue to experience reality. I'm sure I'll figure something out. =p

[erh.germany]

Give me some time to respond. I have to be in the right mood to dive back into the topic. I am busy right now with tech stuff for another channel.