League 4 player here myself. 1 account, good player but not one of the really good ones. I see the vision DC has expressed and believe it possible. This could be an amazingly popular mobile game and if even a fraction of that comes into the ecosystem it could be quite a lot of new player growth.
Can we get a compromised slight adjustment to this that may work for most?
@clayboyn , @davemccoy , @captaindingus , @azircon , @werefox
DC has said below they are basically ready and willing(or can be quickly) to "end this season" & reset leagues to some extent and roll out a reward re-balancing. That will immediately address many concerns with past exploits now fixed. For the most part if you've been a higher league player in the game to date you should have made back at a minimum your ticket costs. I feel it safe to say you've at least started paying off any card costs you may have but that really depends on how much everyone has spent. The game is still expected to go for years one should hope yet so that will be answered over time. Honestly I'd say go a bit further on this reset idea though and here I think I may see pushback. I say reset everyone league 4 and up down to league 3. That removes any unfair advantage earlier players had for bugs/exploits. Going forward however, with fixes in play, we can then run with a more normalized league drop per season perhaps and not be so drastic. Edited to add: I include 4 in the reset to 3 because some players like myself in league 4 were in league 5+ before stake requirements where added.
An "end of season" reset is the first fix called for in captaindingus's summary and suggestion thread below. I'm guessing here but imagining the price of soulboxes could be adjusted quickly/easily as his suggested fix for that. So 2 of the 4 fixes right there.
The third is certainly something that should be fixed & sounds like Splinterlands already has the fix there. I'm not sure how easy/fast it would be for them to make it like Splinterlands though.
Finally is the multi-account issue. I'd be agreeable to the proposed fix of random rules per player for the day on the same map. Everyone in the same league will have the same map combo's to work at each day but under different individual random rules of the day. The rules should be the same for each subsequent replay for that day though imo. It shouldn't come down who pays more each day to not have tower blocker in play. Everyone should have a chance then to spent their tickets on a good day for their shot at being a high scorer. If I'm understanding right this was something already in game at one time? In theory I see why it may have been changed, so everyone fought the same fight. I agree that had the unintended consequence of giving to much power to players with multi-accounts. I further agree captaindingus's suggestion should mostly fix that issue. If each account is under different rules, they will not all be placing every day. There will still be advantage in that at least 1 account should have favorable conditions each day depending, but still not all of them will. Once more I'm not sure on time to implement/how easy to do maybe DC can comment on that for this fix and the one above.
So what if we halt rewards at the end of the vote until DC does rollout the reward changes and reset they are planning on doing anyway. If DC says the other 2 are possible quickly and agreeable with everyone, we can implement the other 2 abuse fixes identified as well and then automatically turn SPS rewards back on with maybe an agreed to 3-6 month test to see if everything is working?
I don't want to see plans DC has in the works completely shut down. There is always the possibility that a majority of the DAO could continually vote off restarting rewards since they will not be able to see that changes are actually working as we will not know if the changes made are going to work or not with out testing them. There will be no real reason to be playing the tourneys if payments are turned off. Especially if players do not know if even the souls they acquire will be kept or if another reset of some kind is coming before we turn things back on.
Also @werefox can we please get word on how easy/fast it would be to switch gateway maps to replay-able after completion. Player's really need the ability to practice maps. Could we open each map up so it can be replayed for no fatigue cost or rewards earned. No soul tokens, SPS, packs etc will be earned for the maps and will off set not costing fatigue imo. Fatigue will then only be required when you could get something out of your playing. Super bonus points if we could toggle different rules too so we can practice that but don't put off replay for it.
Thoughts here? I think if we had gone with the draft stage as normal this could have been worked out during that time if DC is as close as they think on some of this, but now it is all quick quick all or nothing and maybe that isn't absolutely required.
Its really easy for me. @werefox understands we don't want our SPS prize pool being paid out improperly, as even he admits it is now happening.
So he should stop the SPS distribution on his end immediately. Then he can do whatever he needs to do in order to properly make sure the game has integrity, and thus we don't have these exploits draining the rewards pool.
I think its a very fair thing to ask - and I note: AGAIN.
Given that we already had requested this prior to making a proposal and were turned down, we had no choice but to bring a proposal. So how can you compromise with someone that ignores your needs?
I personally want to see the game do well, and I think DC made a mistake by thinking we couldn't or wouldn't do anything if he failed to act. Now I hope he understands we care deeply about the funding we are providing.
We want to see this game take off, but we also want to see fairness and respect for all players in the process too.
Thank you for getting involved @ocoma and hopefully this is just a bump in a very long path going far into the future!
I'm agreeable to immediately ending rewards until the rebalance and league reset sure. I'd just like to see some specifics maybe about what needs to be done to have things start paying out again.
Most of what was used/exploited to get people into the higher leagues faster has been fixed so that isn't happening again once we reset. Nobody is going to be exponentially leveling faster than most the rest now. The reward rebalance should probably include a cap on how much any single account can win at once so we can't have anyone winning 8k SPS per day again though maybe. If leagues are going to have seasons and reset, there will always be someone getting into the highest current league first and having that pot to themselves though or times where leagues may have only a few players while others are getting close to leveling. What does everyone consider fair here then? How much of a league's pool should a single player be able to make, 5%, 10%, 20%? Or do we set a max SPS reward per person per day like 1000 SPS max or insert whatever number?
I really just don't wanna see rewards voted to stop and then nobody can agree later what is acceptable to have them started up again.
I appreciate you taking the time to read what I wrote but the Rulesets must change each map to eliminate the Multi-Account chance of success via the "multiple free attempts" route.
The Maps would stay the same for every play in a day... but it may look like this:
Attempt 1:
Spawnier 17%, Mightier 1%, Tower Lock
Attempt 2:
Spell Freezer, Better Ability 20%, Can't Slow Me 5%
etc, etc, etc - that way no one knows what rules they will face going into the map and they won't have any advantage over someone else by playing multi-accounts
Honest question... does the multi account player not still have advantage there? Maybe even more so?
With 1 account I would get 1 free attempt, then 1 cheap attempt, then 1 more expensive etc. to try again and hope for better rules that allow for a higher score.
With 2+ accounts I would have 2+ free attempts. I would also have 2+ cheap attempts, 2+ more expensive etc. The more accounts one has the more attempts at favorable rules they have and chances at cheaply placing well for that day.
If rules were set per day, a player with multi accounts would still have more chances at better rules for the day since 1 of the accounts will have more favorable rules than the others, but they would also be stuck with some accounts with horrible rules for the day. Would this not be more fair to those who do not have multi-accounts or tons of DEC to spend since statistically everyone should then have days where they have good rules and days with not so good ones?
Edit to add: For the record I'm down for some type of KYC system with limits on both how many accounts a player can have and restricting things so multi-accounts can not be in the same league. Imo anything else is just Band-Aid fixes.