wow thank you for the reply! so all my guesses are wrong.
tbh i've tried many bots. i've also made a simple one for myself to save time. does that mean i'm now barred for life in participating in GPT?
'bad actors' sound a little vague. and if steemit inc starts defining them i'm concerned you're moving towards a centralized system.
i love steemit because it allows all kinds of bots (for now?). some are simply more dumb and abusive. but a lot of them are fighting each other which i don't think ever happened in any other platform (at least not in a meaningful depth and scale like this). like buildawhale vs transparencybot.
so i feel like 'wisdom of the crowd' is already doing its job. just not at the speed/scale/scope you'd probably envisioned. but once you start favoring one behavior over the other i fear you are killing something that just started taking life of its own.
i have more questions and wanted to ask you some of them during gopax meetup that i really wanted to hear from you. didn't get the chance..
but thanks again for clearing one up. i truly appreciate the work you're doing.
When people realize that bidbots are profitable, but only for the powerful ones that have them, people will stop using them and maybe it will really start to be easier to grow in steemit...the only thing the bidbots achieve is to increase the bad distribution of steemit's wealth...we complain about these evils in the world but we accept them in steemit...
i don't think calling something evil and simply dismissing it would benefit anybody either.
bidbots is just one form of it. freedom on the blockchain means there'll always be abusers. but an opposing force as well. wisdom of the crowd should take care of it. if not, it's what we deserve.
i'm concerned about a whitelist run by steemic inc. once you start nurturing something can you really call it a quality post? a platform where anybody can create SMTs and competing is one thing. steemit inc writing down what they define as a 'quality post' is a different matter.
i can only guess the details so i might be completely off. but all i'm saying is you can't define it, let alone have someone create a whitelist for it. for the sake of argument bidbots themselves are original work by programmers. (pls don't get me wrong i'm not supporting bot activity) point being, you can't have 'wisdom of the crowd' when you have the #1 whale overshadowing it.
it's not the wisdom of the crowd ... it's the poverty of the crowd and wanting to get out of a post of 0.10 and that's why they use that rubbish ... I would forbid them on my part and those who have millions to make their business become in delegating sp instead of selling your vote ... so there will be better distribution of wealth and profits that really bring quality and projects
the crowd isn't poor. they're taking part in distribution of over 100s of millions of steem (10s of millions in usd). but i understand what you're saying. you don't like how whales are hoarding all the resources. but they're part of the crowd too. you can't simply take it away from them and distribute.
you did not understand ... the delegations is not to take it away ... they are still theirs ... if you do not start to give important delegations the minnow in the long run or the short one they will leave steemit ... and the whales will eat each other
yes people will always leave for the coolest platform that rewards them with crypto. right now steemit is it. but if GPT becomes the dominant SMT, it's gonna give a big advantage to the next competitor to take what steem once had. in that case, let the minnows leave. you should too. i know i will. but whales? they'll simply jump ship, carry on with their audiences, and continue to be whales.
I'm not going to go because unlike the vast majority, unlike many whales that use their sp without any kind of ethics, that which you defend, I do publish and interact, I do projects in my community for the good of steemit, and also I say things so that steemit does not rot and not only the "steemit is the best in the world" ... if we limit ourselves to that the future of steemit is doubtful ... look how this wealth is distributed in the real world and then compare it with steemit ... if that's the steemit we want, it's all worse than I thought...I fight it, I do not give up
GPT is a completely hypothetical, second token suggested to show one possibility — regardless of GPT, there will be many tokens overlaying each other, and bots of various kinds will still be freely used in the many corners of Steem
@ned thank you so much for taking the time to reply!
i just don't think anybody's gonna overlay you because you're the biggest whale (at least nobody from within the community). but i also have to assume SMTs is gonna allow outside forces to come in and completely change the landscape? possibly someone who's even bigger than you or steemit inc?
i'm wondering if you're talking with the big names and whether they're planning to take part in SMTs or not. facebook is starting their own blockchains division. dan larimer (with all the attention he's getting lately) says he's gonna build a more decentralized social platform on top of eos. sooner or later steemit is gonna have to fight them. but if some of the biggest communities start embracing SMTs, it's a gigantic headstart.
i love steemit because before steemit i considered social media to be a waste of time. i also love the idea of a tokenized world. so i'm rooting for you. and i hope you win.
You are aware that there is no competition since the market is so small? If Facebook comes out with a similar service it will boost Steem Token 100x in value.
So you surmise once FB announces their token approach then the market just expanded by 10,000%?
Yes since they make billions of humans aware of something
😌 just wow...
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Death to the bid bots (and any variations thereof,) Ned. It's either them or us.
"'bad actors' sound a little vague. and if steemit inc starts defining them i'm concerned you're moving towards a centralized system."
UH< YEAH!
That was my initial knee jerk too. (Still suffering from the pain...)
"so i feel like 'wisdom of the crowd' is already doing its job."
Very true, and it's a wisdom of a crowd that understand networks and computers, attempting to let minnows boost their rewards.
"but once you start favoring one behavior over the other i fear you are killing something that just started taking life of its own."
I agree, and it sounds like @ned is not attempting to kill this, but balance it, which is interesting that they could co-exist actually.
Looks like JerryB is happy, so that's a sign...
thanks. i agree with most of what you're saying. except 'balance'.
ned's diagram shows steemit inc running a verification system and behavioral guidelines. it's more like censorship and control.
i'm afraid he's gonna kill it. kill 'wisdom of the crowd' that he's been promoting. kill decentralization and eventually steemit itself. if this roles out and GPT becomes the dominant force, you can be pretty sure it's gameover (unless steemit becomes an entire ecosystem where anybody can create SMTs, but who's gonna want to create one when they know all the front&top pages is controlled by steemit inc?).
i might be wrong because people actually enjoy regulations, censorship, and centralization. so i dunno. but i have money invested in sp. i hope i'm wrong and steem price goes 1000x.
" it's more like censorship and control.
i'm afraid he's gonna kill it. kill 'wisdom of the crowd' that he's been promoting. kill decentralization and eventually steemit itself. "
YOU are seeing much that occurs to me as well. It's not that difficult to take what exists and copy it, move it to another blockchain.
A blockchain with better distribution.
With companies offering millions to motivate developers to create new social media platforms.
With real Decentralization.
Without 51% control by 1 entity.
The motivations to do so are HUGE.
The outcome most likely will look very different from the stiffled and raped rewards pool we see today.
I DO BELIEVE once @ned is actually faced with some "Stiff Competition" (pardon the pun) he will rise to the occasion however ;-)
he did point out that there could be many oracles competing so there's a possibility it might not be so centralized. we'll see how it plays out.
but yes. once people start seeing steemit as a centralized system, it's going to be vulnerable.