Whilst I agree that ats-david is abusing the system, and he has even used my own follower's voting power to flag comments of mine on a couple of occasions, I do not think this is the correct way to go about things.
Flagging the members of the trail, who offered their power with good intentions, is silly. They do not deserve that, nor do they deserve to be excluded from potential curation trails because of the bad choice they made.
If you would like to awaken them to abuse of their power on the part of ats-david, then speak to them. Tell them what you have observed and see if you can convince them to remove their voting power from his trail.
What you are doing now is no better than what he is doing, so if you are really about morality and improving steemit, prove it and change your methodology.
Hes not abusing the system. Those people choose to follow ats david and explicitly chose to follow his downvotes. they also probably had the opportunity to remove those downvotes after they were cast.
where is the abuse?
I don't have time for this conversation. I have had it already. You can observe his use of the delegated voting power on steemdb and decide for yourself whether your interpret it as abuse. I certainly do.
You can also choose to not vote for comments or downvotes in Streemian.. your argument is a moot point.
The only moot point is that you seem to think there is any argument I am participating in. I have previously spoken of this and why it is abuse in great detail. I do not intend to invest any more of my time into discussing it.
I was referring to the set of points you made in your paragraph.
Well, if I was intent on debating I would have expanded on my points. I did not, because the purpose of the message was to persuade the poster to stop flagging people unnecessarily.
I think it is very clear that the message was delivered with this purpose, so when you say my point was moot, you clearly didn't even understand the point.
I think you choosing to use the word argument is rather telling too. It seems that is what you are looking for, and I cannot be arsed to provide you with one.
Please enjoy your night, but do so without messaging me if possible.
Joining a voting trail for profit is voluntary, you can voluntarily choose to follow upvotes or downvotes. Comments and posts. People are not forced into this arrangement. It is not abuse.
Your 'argument' that you say you've covered already can be found here...
https://steemit.com/steemit/@ats-david/on-guilds-and-managing-expectations#@son-of-satire/re-ats-david-re-son-of-satire-re-steemship-re-ats-david-on-guilds-and-managing-expectations-20170212t001436090z
I think your reply certainly counts as racist and incredibly offensive - that's abuse.
Part of it can be found there. Yes. Hence my reluctance to repeat myself when my opinions are already accessible on the blockchain.
I don't remember exactly what I said on the flagged comment, but I am certain it was not racist.
I suggest you read it and maybe apologize for your hateful words and lack of understanding about how the trail system works.
@wingz @sigmajin @ats-david @son-of-satire
I'm not defending anyone here, because I don't know the whole situation and its clear I'm not going to without a whole lot of research that I'm not interested in doing - I'm not going to moderate. I have no stake of any kind in this argument. So, please do not misunderstand this as an attack against any of you - I just wanted to point out something.
Thanks to David, I was able to see what this offensive comment was (scroll down a bit to see the screen capture, which SOS has not called false). I read it with dispassionate interest and it seems to me that emotions are running high because the interpretation that he was being racist is incorrect. Having been in heated debates in the past, I know how easy it is for emotions to make us misunderstand things.
I'm not judging anyone, in case it's not clear.
David was called a cunt, that is true. Yes, it's offensive and if someone wanted to flag him, it would be understandable because it's an ad hominem attack, which I view as unnecessary (although I sometimes FEEL like some users here and elsewhere are deserving, I refrain). Personal attacks tend to produce lasting negative feelings and, except in the case of trolls and similar, are usually not deserved. All of us have our good and bad points.
Personally, I think it's best not to let negative words bother us - it gives others power over us. But, without proper mindfulness, most people can never do that, and the media certainly makes no effort to teach us about more mature ways of reacting to things. Of course, for some people having their image besmirched is a big deal, so they respond by flagging. That is their right.
David was NOT called a nigger, nor was his mother called a whore. The sentence in question is an exemplar of a much worse insult that could've been hurled by SOS, which is clear from his presentation of it ("I don't care if I had called you..."). To claim racism is blatantly incorrect, although I am sure that many people might easily make this mistake - both people for whom English is not their first language, as well as native English users who are not well-versed in grammar.
That is the reason I interjected - to clarify for all who are unaware that no racism is present in the referenced message.
Again, I am a neutral party - I have no idea about the larger issue here, or with @blacklist. Don't shoot the messenger. ;)
I hope you all can settle this matter amicably. Sorry if what I wrote seemed offensive - that was not my intention.
@revugram
I agree with you, sort of, about the you about the use of the N-word. though, the rhetorical trick -- sneaking an an offsenive insult in under cover of a hypothetical "what if i said" or "someone else might say" .
Example (and im really not trying to insult you, as i think you made your point well)
If i said "some people might think that only a stupid asshole would make an argument like the one youre making" im not really calling you an asshole. Except i kind of am. No not technically. But still.
Also, there are some people who consider any use of the n-word to be offensive. Now you might think those people are wrong, and silly, but is their "sacred cow" really any more absurd than SOS's?
ATSD voted -- he expressed an opinion. And SOS found that offensive the same way some people might find the causal use of the n-word offensive. I think both positions are pretty retarded (CWIDT?). But not one more than the other.
Also also, you really don't get to drop the C-bomb and say "his reaction was totally over the top and im so surprised and offended by it."
At best you get to say "i did my level best to provoke this guy by calling him one of the worst words that exists, and now i am going to elect to be super butthurt about his very very very forseeable reaction to that provocation"
Casual use of the n word to make your point isn't racist?
sorry, i don't agree. im not PC, but i do believe that people ought to comport themselves with a certain amount of decorum.
Lol. You're quite the dreamer.
I do not need to search for it. I know that it was not racist, and I have nothing to apologise for.
A friendly reminder...
No surprise then why you were flagged. Stop crying about it and trying to spin it into me being some kind of "abuser." And learn how trails work while you're at it. You have yet to do that, even after the last "discussion."
Indeed. Look at all of the "abuse." You can see the flags and you can see the posts that received them. Trolling and personal attacks/harassment.
https://steemdb.com/@ats-david/votes
They trusted him. He abused that trust. Many have removed themselves from his trail after being notified that their votes were used to flag.
true or false. They signed up of their own violition and agreed to follow his flags, as well as his upvotes, when they had the option to do only the latter.
Are you going to follow me around now?...
yes. Because, i followed you into this thread that i commented on and voted on before you.
beanz - whats happened? Why are you so angry?
I don't think he was wrong about steem guild, I'm glad people brought attention to the flaw in their program. But I will say that I've never liked the way ats-david approaches problems like that. Harassing users like @honeyscribe over having 2 minnow accounts (oh no) for example.
My comments on his post were completely irrelevant to that or to ats as a person. They were directed to smooth in relation to a conversation we had just had on another post. Which happens to be the same argument ats had made about the steemguild (ironically).
So it was all taken out of context.
Ok, that's a fair point. Now I think we both need to go to bed... it's far too late. Why am I even awake? lol
LOL, I'm not angry @wingz. You know me! Did you ever see me angry? I'm a little surprised this guy who used memes to point out steem guild would say that a post with memes pointing out the smooth guild is "deserving" of a bunch of involuntary flags. Really the hypocricy all over this is hilarious.
Edit: I mistakenly thought this was about my reply to mynameisbrian. So to put it into context, check those comments. Or read my "bully" comments on ats-david's post directed at smooth (which you already read and you interpreted correctly that they were directed at him - not the ats-victim) so yeah it's all good you already know.
I know, this is why I'm confused. You were probably one of the nicest funkiest people I met at Steemfest. What I was saying was more in reference to the chat we had the other day about smooth.
I just think ats has tried to argue the points about guilds, voting linearity, hardforks, sock puppets etc reasonably well. I don't see why everyone is having a go at him.