When you said "Good ideas do not require force", it intrigued me. I decided to analyze that quote and look at it from a deeper perspective. Would you say that everything that does not require force a good idea? On the contrary, sometimes good ideas do require force because the powers in control may not want the good idea to manifest. Think about how many good ideas have been forced out of existence because of a small percentage of more powerful people that undermined it's growth through politics. I challenge you to rethink your stance on this quote. Good ideas just might be the ideas that need the most force at the end of the day, and the path of least resistance could just be the easier route and not the one with more benefits.
That becomes a dangerous slippery slope. I contend if it is a good idea it does not require force. I didn't say that meant it would take effect instantaneously because it is a good idea.
However, as soon as you resort to force it is YOU with your perceptions of the world deciding it was a good idea and thus you decide you must apply force to make it happen. What if you were wrong due to your limited knowledge and it was NOT a good idea? Yet you chose to force it into existence.
The problem is even madmen to think their ideas are good ones.
Thus the saying "good ideas do not require force" is more that if they are truly good you likely will not have trouble convincing people to go along with them, and even if it takes time they likely could come to be.
As soon as we resort to FORCE we are deeming us as RIGHT and thus the one who should be able to make the RULES. So begins every dictatorship.
If we take force out of the equation we remove that possibility. Because, whether a lot of people like to admit it or not (not meaning you) each of us is very limited in our knowledge, and we are wrong about a lot of things.
Thus, using force could be a very bad thing backing a WRONG idea simply because we thought it was RIGHT.
I completely agree with you about people having a limited knowledge on topics that we find ourselves backing. And based off of the different moral compasses that guide us, right and wrong could be on the opposite of the spectrum of your counterparts.
While I am not a person who promotes the use of violence to get a point across, I would have to say force does not have to be violent. Just persistence or an aggressive stance could be the force factor.
To believe that people will follow a plan because it is a good idea would be assuming that all people will make the logical decision, which has been proven in numerous fields(economics for one) to not be the case. People will often make choices that are illogical. Thus, people are logically illogical decision makers and this is why I believe that some type of force may have to be implemented for change. Like you said it will not be done instantly but something has to be the catalyst to switch the energy of change or progression from potential energy to kinetic energy. While the black and white of who is wrong and right will not be figured out until time tells, staying in a unpleasant situation because you are trying balance the scales can do just as much harm if not more than one who forces an agenda.
I appreciate your perspective and enjoyed reading your comment.
Likewise. :)
Is democracy a good idea? Is freedom of speech a good idea? Is decentralized banking a good idea? Are basic human rights a good idea? Is promotion by a merit based system a good idea rather than a nepotist system?
If you think about the history of countries all over the world and the steps that were taken to remove royalty and other forms governments that had dynasties of family lines you see the trend of force. While there will always be good ideas that most people can agree on being good ideas, there will always be resistance that wants to hold the common good back for a larger gain for a smaller group of people.
Rights and changes have to be fought for. As long as you think that all you have to do is show people how good an idea is and wait and eventually everyone will see that it is the way to go, then all you will be doing is waiting. A catalyst must be created to push people forward. You can blame cognitive dissonance or whatever, but the fact of the matter is no good idea will be put into play without force because it will always disrupt something else that is going on in another lifestyle.
Do me a favor and give me some examples of good ideas that did not require force to implement.
For the record math has been forced on people, one example would be Peter the Great forcing the nobles to learn math, science, and other specific subjects to keep their positions.
And ok, we can specify each topic down to the exact meaning I am talking about, but it would then only allow for specific holes to be picked at in the idea. How can one debate if basic human rights are a good idea? Like I said everything is somehow going to impact another's lifestyle and it will be viewed as change, change is not normally an easy thing for people to come to terms with. You say that Zomia has lives in anarchy, but I am positive that everyone there did not just think hey, this is a good idea, we should all do this. I'm sure people pushed agendas and aggressively pursued the goal of making anarchy their system. One ruler will take over another ruler but the following is usually a more popular ruler that the people can relate to more than the previous.
I thought I used pretty simple examples, but it seems that they were to broad for you to give thorough answers.