I call bullshit. Illegal immigrants, even if they are taking welfare and expatriate profits, bring far more money and energy to the US economy than they take out of it. If you aren't for open borders, then you don't subscribe to libertarian philosophy--which respects all humans as equal and deserving of the opportunity to make something of themselves.
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Hello @limnerlocin. I am all for open borders, after the theft has been halted. Let people keep the money they earn for themselves, then in January instead of sending out W2s people might receive a list of local charities that they can contribute to, which would benefit the welfare of members of the local community who are in need.
If you really care about liberty, there ought to be no "ifs". Either you believe that the government should prevent free human movement, or they should allow it. The welfare state is not a valid premise to support your argument. It's a straw man.
The welfare state is theft. If you are advocating in favor that it should continue, then we really have nothing more to talk about.
I would encourage you to learn more about the philosophy of liberty. It seems to me as if though your comprehension of certain important aspects are incomplete.
Are you in favor of government sanctioned theft? Because if not, then you should have no problem with my precondition that it be immediately halted, in order that a Libertarian society may exist.
If it is not halted, it is not Libertarian. Your views, they might be more in line with Communism.
Of course the welfare state shouldn't continue--but to argue only against that is to strike at the branch instead of the root. Taxation is theft. Welfare is just as much a static issue as all the other uses of the taxation theft.
My main point is that you ought to be for open borders regardless of the existence of the welfare state; because each aspect of liberty (freedom of movement, freedom of trade, freedom of thought, etc.) is desirable independent of each other, and in fact the liberation of one area helps bring about the liberation of the others. Want to end the welfare state? Opening the borders might be a good way to bring that about.
How do you imagine that opening the boarders might be a good way to bring about the end of the welfare state?
I think if you open the borders prior to ending taxation, that you’re going to end up creating more government dependents.
That-in-itself, would generate a more fervent resistance to the elimination of the income tax, especially when the Statist politicians will no doubt frame the argument that:
as opposed to:
I think it would hopefully be more like "these welfare programs are not sustainable or affordable now that borders are open--so it's time for a scaling back and reform". I mean, even Jerry Brown is addressing the pension crisis in California finally. Not to mention, the amount of capital and profit that having open borders would generate in the market would make it so no one would need or want welfare.
Like a race towards financial default, so that austerity measures can be justified? Maybe that’d work; I mean we’re practically to that point already anyhow. However, the national debt is impossible to pay. In fact the only way to repay it is with more borrowed money. We’re a nation State of slaves indentured to the money masters. Team America might be the only team balzy enough to rebel against the Bankers, but if and when we do, there will be blood. Who knows, maybe it would trigger and extinction level event? We’ve sure got ourselves in a pickle that’s for sure. Good chat man.