The NBA playoffs have become so boring, that today all of the sports talk shows are arguing about a hypothetical point spread that came out of Las Vegas.
What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas... unless it is a nonsensical argument. Then it goes viral.
Apparently "some oddsmakers" (translation: people who want to create something to talk about today) have said that the 2016-2017 Golden State Warriors would be a 6 1/2 point favorite to beat the 1995-1996 Chicago Bulls. The 95-96 Bulls is the team that held the record for most wins in a season (72) until the Warriors broke it last year.
As a 46 year life-long basketball fan, I feel uniquely qualified to pontificate on this hypothetical situation (well at least on this platform because most of you whipper snappers are 30 or under. By the way... get off my lawn you hooligans!).
Back in my day, athletes who flopped were called "soccer players".
But there is one HUGE problem. I am from Chicago. I was in my late teens and early 20s when Michael Jordan and the Chicago Bulls were in their heyday. I studied every game. I have re-watched the 96 playoffs several times (have mentioned that I have never had a life?)
OK I was kidding about the qualifications. I clearly have none. I am just a fan... and a very biased one at that. But I have a keyboard and some stupid ideas so like every other idiot who took the obvious bait, I am going to waste my time arguing about something that is simply impossible to prove without the ability to time travel. If we do get that ability, can we please not waste it on making sports teams from different eras play each other? That is what video games are for. Besides, if we could actually prove our arguments, that would ruin all the fun. The internet has already ruined every bar bet... why let it ruin these important intellectual exchanges as well?
Marty! This almanac says that by 2023, all athletes will be paid in Steem!
As always, I like to put my argument in perspective. We already know I am a huge Bulls fan and saw their greatness unfold before my eyes. However, I am not a big Michael Jordan fan. I firmly believe he is the greatest basketball player ever. He is not the most physically talented player ever (but still top five) but there is no way I would ever pick anyone over him if my life depended on a team winning a game. And that is what made him so great. He played every game like his life depended on it. His drive to win was second only to... his hatred of losing. He hated losing. Some would argue it was so extreme that it was not mentally healthy.
Jordan played the entire second half of this game with his eyes closed. He only scored 26 points.
I simply like watching Scottie Pippen more. I liked his all around unselfish game... which was undoubtedly made better by being next to the greatest player ever.
I also respected Dennis Rodman's game and hung out at the some of the same clubs he frequented in Chicago. He was clearly a weirdo (so am I)... but he never "big timed" anyone.
Ladies and gentlemen... your 2016-2017 all scream team!!!
Now onto this year's Golden State Warriors. I can honestly say I have never seen anything like them (and I remember the "Showtime Lakers"). They are probably the greatest offensive team I have ever seen. They have two of the greatest scorers in the history of the NBA playing together in their prime. That simply does not happen. Then you toss in Klay Thompson who has the ability to score 37 points in a quarter. Sprinkle in a playmaking, do-everything, power forward and you are looking at a unicorn. There is not a single team in the NBA today that can possibly legally guard them. Perhaps the NBA, its sponsors, and its refs will combine with LeBron James to slay this unicorn (ooo that is gross... I hope my daughter doesn't read that) but even if this happens, I would stand by my statement that they cannot be legally guarded by any team in the NBA.
But here is the rub. People who have only heard of the Bulls' greatness may not know they were one of the best defensive teams ever. They were certainly the best defensive team I have ever seen. That team's starting lineup contained three of the greatest defensive players in the history of the game in Jordan, Pippen and Rodman. Their starting "point" guard Ron Harper was no slouch either (he is 65th all time in defensive win shares... so maybe it is 4 of the greatest defenders off all time).
We need to set some ground rules! And why wasn't I named to the all scream team?!
Before proceeding, I need to set a quick ground rule. Although there have been no major changes to the actual rules, each era had their "unique" way of officiating. For example, the clutching and grabbing in the past is no longer allowed. Conversely, the "Euro step" was simply called "traveling" back in the day.
For the purpose of this argument, I am assuming that these elite athletes would all adjust to the rule interpretations of the day and would still perform at a high level. Therefore, I am just going to pretend that the officials will call the game according to the actual rules in the NBA rule book. (I know the entire premise just completely fell apart because there is absolutely no chance of that happening... but the whole damn thing is made up so I can make that up if I want!)
Back to the game.
So we have a matchup of the unstoppable offense versus the impenetrable defense. What an awesome nonsensical argument to set up!!!
I have only mentioned 4 players for each team. Why? The 5th starter is a total throw away. I like Luc Longley but there is no way he was the deciding factor in any of the Bulls' games. The same goes for Zaza Pachulia (not the part about me liking him... he just looks like he smells really bad).
Although neither team had a great bench, they both had contributing 6th men. The Warriors' Andre Iguodala brings excellent defense with some good offense while the Bulls' Toni Kucoc brought the exact opposite. Each player complimented the starters well.
In order to avoid splitting hairs, I will call the benches a wash and just move on to the starting match-ups.
There are many possible matchup combinations. Perhaps you rest Durant and have him cover Rodman... but do you want Durant taking that punishment under the boards? Maybe Green guards Jordan for a while... but how many fouls can he give? In my opinion, there are many different match-ups, each with its own set of pluses and minuses. In the end, these are two incredibly evenly matched teams. In fact, I think it is a complete tossup... until you add in Jordan.
During the third quarter of this game, Michael Jordan played 6 minutes all by himself before the rest of the Bulls realized the time-out had ended and play had resumed. The Knicks outscored the bulls 13 to 12 during the six minute stretch. After the game, Jordan made himself run 23 laps as punishment for being outscored.
Between 1991 and 1998*...
Michael Jordan. Would. Not. Lose.
Is there any logic in that statement? Nope. Does that make it any less true? Nope.
The guy was a killer. I would argue the most cold hearted killer ever.
If you had to bet your mortgage on this game, could you ever bet against Michael Jordan? I know I couldn't.
Even if Jordan died at halftime, I think I would still probably pick his corpse to lead the Bulls to victory in the second half.
If you really need some concrete evidence, one merely needs to look at Jordan's performances in game 7s of the finals.
Oh wait. He never had any of those because Jordan always won in 6 or less.
Ok. I left myself wide open for shots on this one. Feel free to take some at me in the comments below. Who do you think would win this hypothetical match-up and why?
*Perhaps if Jordan didn't "retire" in the middle of the run, Olajuwan and the Rockets would have defeated him... but I doubt it.
Its tough to have a sports argument without tossing in some stats. If you need them, here are the traditional (old school non-scientific) stats for both teams from http://www.basketball-reference.com.
Vegas info from http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2713807-vegas-oddsmakers-would-favor-17-warriors-over-michael-jordans-96-bulls
What a refreshing post. I have been beaten down by politics all day. To come home and see this made my day.
Personally, I think Golden State wins. While the Bulls had Jordan and really good support players, Golden State has 2 superstars and 3 other players that can go off at any moment (i.e. D. Green)
Thanks for the post. I will follow!
Wow! I take this as a tremendous compliment. This is exactly what I am going for. There are plenty of places to go for serious/depressing stuff. I really try to write content that is a distraction. Its ok to worry about the world and try to improve it... but sometimes you just need to take a breath and laugh.
Thank you so much for this comment. It really put a smile on my face knowing that I provided a a brief break from the craziness of the "real" world.
good posting
고맙습니다. 나는 너의 포스트를 또한 즐기고있다.
Thanks corn! I have been checking out yours too and trying to use google translate as much as possible.
This Chicago Bulls team was amazing to watch..... on TV for me though. And Jordan was an amazing Basketball player, and to this day I don't think I have seen another Basketball player with the same Consistent Amazing ability like MJ, although I give Kobe a close 2nd.
Great post @hanshotfirst Amazing times these are!
Thanks! Yeah MJ was one of the most unique players I have ever seen. He fought with teammates if he felt they weren't practicing hard enough. The guy was kind of crazy when it came to improving and winning. I honestly think if he thought someone on the Warriors could stop him, he would simply develop a move that could not be stopped.
A mid table team would beat the best team of 30 years ago in any sport. Fitness, tactics, roster dept have all improved too much.
That is a great point. Since this is totally hypothetical, I would add that Jordan and the Bulls would have access to the same training techniques.
As far as tactics go, I think both coaches would adjust to however the refs called the mythical game.
I will definitely concede the idea of the over all roster depth in the league. One factor I missed was the addition of talented European players to today's game.
I do think for these two teams, the bench would not be a deciding factor.
I don't think it fair, even hypothetical, to retrain them. Who knows how a player would react to the more intensive training of today. Maybe there body wouldn't be able to take it or there mind.
Yeah that is one of the problems with this silly arguments... so many assumptions on both sides. I am assuming that in order to be an elite basketball player, the athletes put in countless number of hours of intense training. That training may look different in different eras but I am guessing that the mindset is the same and they do anything they can to perfect their craft.
Of course you may be correct and players from the past might see a training regimen from today and say "forget that". But I just happen to think there is something special inside elite athletes that make them rise to the challenge... that is why they are elite.
yea you got a point about the top of the top
Yeah I am completely guessing. I can't imagine the drive it takes to be the best of the best.
These "super teams" in the NBA has honestly made me become less of a fan of the organization. Knowing at the beginning of the season that Cleveland and Golden State were going to make the finals makes the rest of the season very boring.
Agreed! Do you think there's something that can be done to end this trend?
Unfortunately I do not. The NBA players of this current day are molded into this mindset that if they do not have a ring then their career is a waste. Rings definitely are amazing accomplishments, but no body in this world thinks that Brian Cardinal is better than Charles Barkley. I think the major turning point of the NBA becoming less exciting to me was Kevin Durant's decision to sign with the Golden State Warriors. Kevin's decision to leave a great basketball organization in Oklahoma City to go the statistically greatest team of all time is still mind boggling to me. Especially when he had just been knocked off in the playoffs by them the previous year. If you can't beat them, you might as well join them right? Once Kevin set the gas trail on fire, we started seeing great role players such a Derrick Wiliiams, Deron Williams, and Kyle Korver go to Cleveland to ring chase as well. Cleveland needed to add these role players so they could have fire power against this insane Golden State team. This trend of super teams will not stop, rather it will just change teams. Once Lebron James retires, we may see super teams start to surround players such as Giannis Antetokounmpo, or possibly even Joel Embiid. The current state of the NBA is down right boring in my honest opinion, and the key to my avoidance of watching NBA this season was super teams.
You really know your stuff, followed! Thanks for your insights!
I agree but think this 100% began with LeBron James. He made it normal for a superstar to try and find the easiest path to a championship. I honestly think it "broke" the NBA.
Lebron definitely was a pioneer. His situation was more understandable then Kevin's. Lebron was surrounded with very average players at best. Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Anderson Varejoa, and Mo Williams are not reliable options. He wanted to win but wasn't provided the tools needed to win. Kevin on the other hand, had a monstrously defensive front court of Steven Adams/Kendrick Perkins and Serge Ibaka, and the two main MVP candidates of this season at his side at one time and still couldn't win a championship. Kevin's decision was very poor for his popularity and appeal to every other fan. Lebron's decision was very controversial back then, but he is now known as a hero. He is the super hero that needs to kill the villain.
I agree 100%. I used to be a season ticket holder. I gave those up after last year's finals. I am not the desired demographic of this NBA. I am too old and don't consume my sports in tiny chunks online.
Michael Jordan had a farm...
I love MJ!
Give me five!
Not sure what this means exactly but it made me laugh.
I'm not a huge fan like you or in any way qualified to make any comments on this article but I do want to say its nicely written. I read the whole thing because of your writing skills. :D
That's ok I'm not qualified either lol.
But that is a very nice compliment. That was very kind of you to say. I really do just want to provide people with a little distraction and hopefully some fun.
Well you entertained me, I usually don't read the sports articles but might have to start. :D
That would be an interesting matchup to say the least. Even though Air Mike is hands down the best NBA player of all times, this Golden State team is no slouch. I think GS have better three point shooters and great team, Bulls had all around great team but not as great three point shooters. If Jordan had a bad day his bench would cover him nicely, Toni Kukoč for example was one of the best players at that time and was the key 6th player. Overall quality of GS is slightly better, but that would be one hellova game to watch. It would be close, I would say in the end by some factors GS would win 4-2 or 3:)
I was surprised when I sat down to write this. My initial knee-jerk reaction was "No way Golden State could compete." But as I looked at it, I couldn't believe how evenly matched it would be. Its honestly a ridiculous argument because the game and players are so different than they were 20 years ago... but it was still fun.
holy shit dude that was a basketball rant! LOL didn't see that angle from Vegas.. but yah thanks for the post.
Thanks lol! Yeah I was big into sports for quite a while. Getting tougher and tougher to enjoy. I am so old. LOL
Ha! This was what I thought about commenting, but just like in the years of being a basketball fan, you beat me to it haha! As one of those hooligans you shoo'd away from your lawn, I felt obliged to chime in with my thoughts.
You beat me to the punch once again with regard to Iguodala and Kukoc. Had Iguodala turned into a better player when he was younger (I've always called him Diet LeBron because of his stats), the Warriors would've been a lock for me. But, as it stands, it's a closer fight.
Jordan's Bulls were every Filipino's favorite team at the time. It's weird to say that MJ was the X-Factor, but he truly was. I do believe he would've definitively owned the 90s had he not
suffered financial troubleretired. It's funny you mentioned that his Bulls won 6 games or less, especially since they won 6 titles haha!With that being said, it's hard to argue against a team that won 73 games last year and have yet to lose in this season's playoffs. Sure, one could argue that 72 and 69 (both with championships) are a better record, but it's hard to compare just by looking at records. The Warriors have 2 MVPs, one catch-and-shoot player that only needs 11 dribbles to score 60 points, and a bench that could easily be starters elsewhere. I mean, who are you going to double up in that team? They don't even boast a player that's touted as the greatest of this generation on their roster.
I'm a Spurs lifer, so I have a fondness for the West. Michael Jordan is the GOAT, but I have to give this one to the Warriors.
Thank you for reminding me about the 11 dribble 60 point game! That was actually funny. It was like a video game! After Wednesday night I might even change my mind... but I'm not betting against Jordan ever! LOL
Great comment! Thank yo so much for taking the time to share that.
Oh, I'm never betting against Jordan as a player. GOAT for sure, never going to be toppled by any would be pretender. Now that the Warriors failed to capture that perfect 16-0, I'm having second thoughts haha! We'll have to wait a couple of years more to have a definitive answer, I guess!
Man like you said. Two very different eras. The late 90's was alot of bruising basketball with scores sub 100.....now it's run and gun let it fly can't hank check anymore poetry in motion.
Someone like "The Glove" wouldn't even be able to play in this league now. He had the best hand check in history and is considered an all time great defender because of it.
I will say, I do enjoy watching Steph let it fly though. It's crazy how he can make it rain.
And on a totally random topic. I would love to see a time warp where LeBron had to play against the bad boy Pistons. First time down the lane Laimbeer is close lining him and turning him into a jump shooter the rest of the game.
Get kicked out of the league for that now!
Oh yeah you are old school! I of course hated the bad boys... but still respect them. Much prefer them to Lebron.
You are right about Payton... but I think he would have adjusted to the rules and found a way to drive people crazy!
Oh, I couldn't stand the pistons then either for the exact example I used..haha. I was a huge Magic Johnson and showtime laker fan when I was back in Junior high school...still have that gold jersey in my closet. Wish I could still fit in it! :-)
Don't forget the short shorts!
I really want to have something witty or intelligent to put in the comment section of this post, alas I know more about football than basketball (and what I know about football is entirely based on facebook debating between a few of my close friends)
You said whippersnappers. For some reason that brought to mind Nottinghill and Hugh Grant saying Whoopsie daises, lol.
EVERYTHING you say is witty and intelligent! LOL
Every once in a while I try to throw some sports out there. There isn't a big sports crowd here yet so I at least try to throw some humor in the pictures I choose or highlight the human side of it.
Aw, what a lovely thing to say! And actually I enjoyed the post despite sports not being my thing, so well done!!
You take it seriously bro !
=]
"Even if Jordan died at halftime, I think I would still probably pick his corpse to lead the Bulls to victory in the second half." - nice one !!!!!!!
=]
LOL. Thanks! That dude just refused to lose. it wa beyond a game to him. It was clearly not healthy... but it made him great.
With a passion, to the target by all cost ! Great example of success.
Do you know? What is he doing now ?
He is part owner and he is running the NBA Charlotte Hornets. He is not a very good executive though. I think he expects players to be able to be like him. They can't lol.
Hi is One of the Best !!!
Thank you for interesting conversation !
Will Follow you for news.
Hope to talk to you soon.
=]
Thanks!
Nice article. So you were not kidding about having no life :D But seriously this is a very in-depth look at the problem. I know that Curry is also known for his ability to score and change the game in last minutes but I would also pick MJ any day without hesitation. Just by looking at 1998 finals against Jazz or even his last game you can see true definition of "dedication". His will power was always of the charts so for me he is still the GOAT.
Yeah I don't know how to quantify Jordan's "will" . It was real and it was spectacular though.
Great post and very interesting topic. These types of arguments are fun as it's great to compare the past legends to the modern era.
Basketball is such an interesting game and topic as it's one of the few sports where pure raw athleticism does not dictate what team or players may have dominated in a particular era.
For example in football. The athletes today who play football are freaks of nature. Hall of Famers who played in the 70s and 80s would not even make a division 1 college program. Frank Gifford who is a hall of fame running back would likely have be a ball boy in today's football.
But basketball...who is to say Michael Jordan would not dominate in this era. Maybe he is just special? A once in a lifetime player. How would John Stockton do in today's NBA?
But in this argument regarding the Bulls vs the Warriors it would depend on rules. There was hand checking back in the Jordan era. If the Warriors played in the Jordan era there would be lower scoring games with Curry and Thompson would be flat on the court getting beat down. Draymond Green would have Dennis Rodman draped on him all game. Bull win with those rules.
In today's NBA the Warriors would take it. We would see Rodman,Longley, and Pippen riding the bench with all of their fouls and the Warriors would likely shoot 40+ free throws a game and still getting open looks for 3's.
But ya never know. That is whats fun about these bar room debates. All opinions are valid as we will never know!
Yeah the rule question was a huge problem. Such a different game now. And you are so right about the NFL. 30 years ago there were maybe 5 guys who weighed 300 pounds.
"*Perhaps if Jordan didn't "retire" in the middle of the run, Olajuwan and the Rockets would have defeated him..." As a Rockets fan, It sucks to always have to hear "what if" we would've played against Jordan. I love the Rockets, and i'm glad we have our Championships, and on a side note, I love Jordan and his drive to succeed. I base my opinion off of history...defense wins championships, and the Bulls would take the Warriors in 6. Curry would walk away beat up, and would probably retire.
Nice post. Now I gonna love this game much more. Thanks ..share more post about basketball.
Bulls, have to go with the Bulls.
Michael Jordan is such a great inspiration in many ways, we all have a lot to learn from this man. His biography is a great read !
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great article, thanks for sharing
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Cool post
BE HUMBLE!
nice post.
https://steemit.com/education/@steemiteducation/steemiteducation-education-matters
Thanks!