I've been an expat for a long time. It is quite rare that i meet someone that has been doing it longer than I have and while this doesn't necessarily mean that I am special, it does mean that I have seen and done a lot more than the average person who spends a year or two living outside of their own country. I have been doing it for so long that i experience culture shock when I visit my home country, not the other way around.
In my travels and the places I have lived I have met a ton of people from all over the world and most of them have been really fantastic folks. There are some undesirables out there though that give all of us a bad name and unfortunately these are the ones that stick out in the minds of the locals more than any of the people that are just living life normally. I noticed a couple of these in the past week but I have been seeing them for a very long time and in almost anywhere that I go in SE Asia.
Here's just a couple of examples but there are a lot more.
The "everywhere is the beach" people
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I love Randy from Trailer Park Boys so I have no issue with him. However, the other day I was at a shopping mall and there was a guy that was actually inside the mall without a shit on, wearing flip flops and seemed to be completely unconcerned about the fact that this is not the beach. In fact, it is miles from the beach and definitely not a place that you should be walking around like this. This is not an isolated situation unfortunately and there are a lot of travelers that come to this and other SE Asian beach areas that somehow got the impression that it is ok to just not wear clothes wherever they happen to go. Most Asian countries are actually very conservative and this was clearly making people very uncomfortable. I think it takes a special kind of stupid to do this but this guy seemed to be completely unaffected by the fact that he was being a jackaloon.
When I see people like this I want to walk up to them and ask them "would this be ok in your home country?" because they answer to that question is almost certainly "no." This is not a playground nor a beach, how about having some decorum and respect?
Excessively drunk and loud in public
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I have no problem with drinking and getting drunk. I do entirely too much of it myself. On the other hand though I am a very polite drunk and so are almost all of the people that I know. If we do get a new member of our group that is too loud when drunk they will not remain part of it for very long. It is on the other hand, extremely common for the expat community in any of the areas that I have lived to have a regular that is excessively drunk on a regular basis and making everyone's night less enjoyable because of it. Shouting at televisions, getting into arguments with staff, or getting irate with other patrons over something as meaningless as a game of pool that nobody is gambling on are just a few of the examples of people making fools of themselves in public.
This behavior is noticed by the locals and it reflects badly on all of us as a result. I don't know exactly what it is about being an expat that leads to this sort of behavior that I rarely noticed outside of college in the west, but it does seem to be something that quite a few people engage in on a regular basis. When I see people like this I immediately know that I do not want to associate with them and for the most part the only people that do associate with them are other people that are the same way. This compounds the problem because a gaggle of loud drunks is much worse than one on their own.
I think what a lot of people need to keep in mind is that we are guests in these countries and we are very fortunate to have the luxury of being capable of living in them. When people act a fool on a regular basis and do things that would likely result in them getting arrested "back home" and feeling as though they can do it with impunity (which they kind of can here) it makes the situation less likely to be able to continue.
How about just acting like a normal human being and being polite? Is that too much to ask?
Ermmm... I think I did all that when I visited Macau sometimes back. I was not too happy with the bar not allowing me to smoke indoors, so I snatched a table, pulled it out of the bar, sitting by the roadside continued drinking and smoking until a patrol car stopped by and escorted the drunken me away 🤣
P/s: also walked into a mall by the beach without my shirts on once in my home country 😂 trust me, there was an accident. My clean clothing were in the car, i jumped into the sea with the keyfob in my pants 🤣 i had to get in the mall, buy a new shirt whilst im dripping so i can sort the car security system off
oh, i love your PS story. This is fine... and I am sure you were very embarrassed during all of it. I bet that instance sticks in your head and will for the rest of your life.
I know exactly what you are talking about. It happens here in Chiang Mai even though we are extremely far from any beach. I get that it is hot here, but that is no excuse to skip common courtesies like wearing clothes.
a while back a friend of mine was visiting and when we met up at a coffee shop for breakfast he was shirtless. I told him I was not going to sit with him unless he put a shirt on. We were at a "beach town" but were 20km from the nearest sunbathing area. What a moron. I still pick on him about this to this day.
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You need to adjust yourself according to rules and regulation of the place you are visiting. Hovering around with out shirt is a shameful act specially where these kind of activities are prohibited, by doing this you can hurt the sentiments of human. If you can't do it in your home town, why you are doing in other countries ? did you said anything to that man who were with out shirt ?
No, I didn't say anything to him but I did grimace in his general direction as did the other people that were with me. I guess that guy just has no shame but if I was to say anything to him I would ask him where he was from and then say "would it be ok for you to be out in public like this where you are from?"
And when the number of expats increase in a country, their bad behaviors become allowable.
urgh... this is a very real fear. I'm not saying that the locals don't get stupidly drunk here as well because they certainly do but I just notice it a lot more when it is one of "my people."
I enjoy being an expat and would like to continue doing it for the rest of my life but when people like this do this in public, it makes us all look guilty even if we didn't do anything.
Being a guest in people's country doesn't give anyone the right to do as they please. People have their norms which I feel should be respected. There is an adage that says, "If you are in Russia, act like a Russian". This simply means respecting people's culture even if you won't practice it.
When in Rome, do what the Romans do.
As simple as that.
Even many of those companies that produce the alcohol drinks tend to always tell people that they should "drink responsibly "...drinking is not bad in my own opinion but drinking irresponsibly is the bad thing.
I don't even have a problem with people getting seriously drunk. I do it on a regular basis but I'm a very polite drunk and also never do things like shout out in the night in a neighborhood where the people are sleeping.
I think the companies say "drink responsibly" because they are required to say that by the government. What they really want you to do is buy as much of their product as possible :)
Valid point.
⋆ ᴛʜᴇ ᴘʟᴀᴄᴇ ғᴏʀ sᴏᴜᴛʜᴇᴀsᴛ ᴀsɪᴀɴ ᴄᴏɴᴛᴇɴᴛ ᴏɴ ʜɪᴠᴇ
⋆ sᴜʙsᴄʀɪʙᴇ ᴛᴏ ᴛʜᴇ ᴀsᴇᴀɴ ʜɪᴠᴇ ᴄᴏᴍᴍᴜɴɪᴛʏ
⋆ ғᴏʟʟᴏᴡ ᴛʜᴇ ᴀsᴇᴀɴ ʜɪᴠᴇ ᴄᴏᴍᴍᴜɴɪᴛʏ ᴠᴏᴛɪɴɢ ᴛʀᴀɪʟ
⋆ ᴅᴇʟᴇɢᴀᴛɪᴏɴ ʟɪɴᴋs 25 ʜᴘ⇾50 ʜᴘ⇾100 ʜᴘ⇾500 ʜᴘ⇾1,000 ʜᴘ
I rarely even take my shirt off at the beach, so I can't even imagine doing that in other public places. I always laugh when I see people driving around with no shirt on. I think I am a happy drunk for the most part but I know the kind of people you are talking about.
Some of my close friends are horrible drunks and I let them know about this as well. Some of them I have trained a bit and I will tell them "Alan, you are starting to go over to the dark side buddy." Sometimes this will have a calming effect on them at least for a bit but other times it just makes them more aggressive and when that happens I leave them to it by walking away.
I don't think there is much you can do at that point. I'm not even sure it is a behavior that can be changed given the impairment that comes with it. I know my brother in law can drink most anything and he is fine, but when he drinks gin he gets mean. Could be just figuring out what you need to avoid.
I agree. It makes me uncomfortable and it's rude and I believe many feel the same, especially here in Malaysia, where showing too much skin is generally frowned upon.
I first learned of the conservative nature of Asians when I first moved to Thailand and worked in SCUBA diving. When we were loading up our gear we would see Thai families at the beach as well and more often than not they weren't even wearing swimming suits... they were completely dressed in shorts and a shirt and this was especially true for the women.
I think that foreigners get given a pass at the beaches here because without them, there would be substantially less profitability for these beach areas. But once you are no longer at the beach, it is time to put your clothes back on, people :)
Yes, that is true. There are beaches where people can wear skimpy swimwear, usually famous touristy spots or resorts.
It is strange how people act and don't give two shits what they look like. I recall seeing a lady in her dressing gown, plus curlers and slippers out shopping, but then I guess this would be common in the States with the Walmart photos I have seen. Maybe he was going in to buy a shirt lol as that is the only excuse I can think of that would possibly make sense.
I thought of exactly that even before I got to the part of your sentence that said Wal-Mart. I think the people of Wal-Mart is a rather popular Reddit category if I am not mistaken.
I seriously doubt that guy was there to buy a shirt :)
To answer the ultimate question, I think it is too much to ask, but I am cynical human with little faith left in humanity. I too am the expat that stuck around too long, and here in Cambodia most people that stick around this long either become overtly successful or fall apart as a human being. I am one of the rare ones that is pretty much the person I was almost 15 years ago when I got here.
Cheers to you for hanging onto sanity all these years and maintaining enough self-discipline to stay upright 👊😉.
it does take a lot of self-control to not implode over here. Seeing as how there are almost zero consequences that would get you in a lot of trouble in the West, the only thing keeping you from destroying your own life over here, is you. Unfortunately, I think that this part of the world and how affordable it is attracts a lot of people that lack this level of self-control and they give in to drugs and drink until it shatters their very existence.
Good work on remaining who you are. I gained a bunch of weight since moving over here but to be fair I was nearly 20 years younger when I moved to this part of the world and I believe this to be an acceptable excuse.