RE: Random thoughts.

First off, as a fat guy, I eat any and all food.

Well.. Right off the bat, why should anyone really take you as a source for authority on the subject if you're unhealthy? Being fat is not healthy, it puts extra stress on the internal organs and body.. So.. If you're not concerned about your health very much, why should others follow your thoughts about such?

That being said there is an obvious difference between vegan and non-vegan ice cream.

Not really in my opinion. I've tried them and they taste the same, I actually like vegan products more cause they don't have blood and pus and mammary gland secretions from an animal full of steroids and all kinds of chemicals. But you don't seem to be too concerned about your health so.. Yeah...

I've yet to see vegan ice cream that costs less than animal based ice cream.

Make your own, then it is cheaper. But due to the fact that vegan foods are still new and they are facing a lot of pushback from animal agriculture products who are scared of the competition, it might be a while before you find similar prices in regards to some of these specialty items at the store, but if you made it yourself it'd be way cheaper.. So.. Your argument is likely one of inconvenience of not wanting to make your own ice cream which would be even cheaper..

all farmers get subsidies and plenty of favorable tax laws.

Do small farmers get subsidies?
Or just the big ones?

This is quoted from an article in 2011, probably not much has changed.

"Between 1995-2009, taxpayers shelled out $246.7 billion dollars in subsidies. Sixty-two percent (62%) of American farmers received no subsidy at all. These no-subsidy farmers and ranchers are primarily small operators grossing under $250,000 a year on their farms. In other words, these are family farmers that fit the idea most Americans have of farmers."

Source = http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daniel-krotz/small-farms-and-the-farm-_b_817869.html

If you wanted to buy a hamburger that wasn't subsidized.. It would cost..

A typical hamburger would cost between something like $30 to $50 if it wasn't subsidized.
I know most people I know wouldn't be eating meat if it cost that much.

Yet they can go to the local farmers market and easily buy enough plants to live on without any government intervention or subsidization.. Hmmmmm.........

Honestly, the answer to your question is profitability. If you can improve the profitability of vegan products, you'll get what you want. Hell, they may even take the spot of meat products.

Give it time, things are changing actually.. The consumption of meat and dairy are going down in the industrialized world while vegan products and substitutes are sky rocketing.

Unfortunately China and much of the developing world are now going through their bloodlust and puslust phase.

But.. I imagine during my lifetime, before I die.. Eating animal products will be much more uncommon and eating plants will be much more common.

More and more people are waking up in big numbers all the time thanks to the internet and all the new science and information coming out.. Though.. People who don't care about their health very much, and who are basically addicted to the taste of dead flesh.. They will be around for a while. Even if most of the population went vegan, you'll still have some hardcore weird dudes eating raw flash in their backyard or whatever.

Also, I find it ironic that you think I haven't done my research but provide no citation for your own.

I have no problem providing links or references or studies to anything I've proclaimed if they exist, request proof for a specific claim and I will.

I was just stating you don't seem very knowledgeable on the subject, and I stand by it. Especially based on your last response, you don't seem to care about your health very much, or the health of the planet, or the health of the animals you ruthlessly consume.

PS I still think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the pricing of vegan options.

Look, in order to get dairy or meat you have to feed that animal a LOT of plants.. If you just eat those plants instead of feeding them to the animals.. Not to mention all the extra land and water and resources.. There's been a lot of studies done and it's WAY cheaper to eat plants.

Also carbon emissions if you believe in global warming, animal agriculture is the leading cause of that..

You just don't really understand the science behind farming and land usage and water and resources, even though people have been pointing this stuff out for thousands of years.. People thousands of years ago were saying.. HEY.. Why are you killing animals for no reason when it takes up even more land and water and resources? Yet.. Here we are.. Thousands of years later and it's like people are zombies addicted to their flesh..