I could start this post with saying that what most people perceive as chemtrails are actually crystals of water vapor from jet engines. Just as easy I could be dismissed since really there is no way to tell. Side A defends that the evil elite are trying to control either the human population or the weather or for some, both. Side B believes there is nothing going on because all evidence suggests that there is nothing going on. The point of my post is not to repeat the same information you can find on google but actually stimulate some critical thinking from those who actually believe that some people are spraying evil substances in our... common sky.
And this would be my first argument. We all live under the same atmosphere. We all breath the same air. This means that any form of harmful substance that would be sprayed from the evildoers will eventually be inhaled by them and their children. Earth is a closed system. Nobody can escape the poison. In a more satirical way, the government might be spraying itself in order to control it better. They do seem to be doing an awful job at everything they touch anyways.
And this would be my second argument. Conspiracy theorists claim that the private sector can do any job much better. How on earth then a group of incompetent government leeches can pull off such an extravagant plan? What is the endgame of such plan? If population control is indeed the evil masterplan then that also would be contra to the elite's plans that want more and more wage slaves to do the menial jobs while themselves cash out from their minions.
Third and most important: The internet can spread good information as much as it can spread bullshit. For the money making savvy, you should understand that there is a market for everything out there. The more educated a person is, the harder is to sell something. People read that the atmosphere has particles of "strontium, barium and aluminum" and immediately think that these must come from the mysterious lines in the sky that don't seem to go away fast enough. Ignorance and fear fills in the gaps in most people's heads. I mean how on earth did they end up there ...rrriiight?
The more people that support the idea, the more likely is to be believed no matter how absurd it is. Say to any person today that they passed by the cemetery and saw zombies blessing the living and they will laugh at you or call psychiatric services. Tell them that this happened 2000 years ago in an era where any person of power could claim anything and people not only buy it but willingly worship it. Tradition is a very strong force and it seems that the earlier in life we are taught something the more likely future generations will believe it.
Forget about the peer-reviewed studies that say there is no collusion. Screw the consensus from the scientific community. At the end of the day, they could all be in it, munching grants and filling up their pockets right? The point of this post is to think about the issue critically with the tool in our disposal aka our brain.
There is no need to believe papers or other scientists but rather examine whether the accusation claims actually stand under rigorous critical analysis. If at the end of the day every single accusation can be explained by simple understanding of physics and chemistry it means that what we are witnessing is rather a confirmation that most people are scientifically illiterate.
Ask yourself. Why do you believe the conspiracy theory? What are your evidence? Is there a direct causation? Could a correlation fool your judgement? I believe any person examining the issue critically and not emotionally would be able to dismiss the chemtrail narratives with ease.
If you could for your next article explain these 175 US patents on geoengineering of me.
http://www.naturalnews.com/2017-09-10-175-patents-prove-that-geoengineering-and-weather-control-technologies-are-real.html
"natural-news" . instant fail.
geoengineering =/= burgers =/= chemtrails
Forget the source. You can't explain away 175 US patents. They exist. I didn't figure you would go there cause you can't.
Of course he can not ... you need more than sarcasm and good writing skills to disprove something that is so evident at the moment. Life is hard sometimes
patents =/=chemtrails
I've got an open mind. And would change my mind on this topic, IF you presented some factual evidence rather than rhetorical jargon to dispute it. patents=/=chemtrails? Oh brilliant. I guess that makes it not so. You don't address any of the facts. Or maybe just again don't care to. Cause you can't.
They called cloud-seeding also https://www.thenational.ae/uae/uae-cloud-seeding-technique-wins-provisional-us-patent-1.42817
Source: http://www.geoengineeringwatch.org/links-to-geoengineering-patents/
Why do I think something is going on in our skies?
1 - Up until a couple years ago I spent the entirety of my life in or around the Sacramento area of Northern California.
When I was a kid the skies were a beautiful blue and planes never left miles long streaks in the sky.
In the early nineties I got in to landscape photography. I spent a lot of time looking at the sky and there were no long streaks.
The last summer I spent in Cali was 2015. It doesn't rain during the summer in Sac, that's why the skies were always a rich beautiful blue. I worked outside and would watch as they sprayed the blue sky to the point it was a solid gray haze by noon that wouldn't go away.
It's a stretch to believe that ice particles are hanging in the sky hours on end with the sun beating through them and it's 100 degrees on the ground.
2 - Elevated amounts of Aluminum and Barium have been found in rainwater and soil tests around the US.
3 - They tell us about it. http://www.cftc.gov/idc/groups/public/@lrfederalregister/documents/frcomment/08-004c002.pdf Page two states it's a reality. The last paragraph on page 4 starts talking about chemtrails.
I also found legislation on govtrack from 2001 about chemtrails but can't find the link now on my phone. :(
(Edited: found it, it didn't pass, but they wouldn't attempt legislation mentioning chemtrails if they weren't real https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/107/hr2977/text)
The video frankenskies on YouTube is all news clips and other clips like military training that shows they have been telling us about weather modification for some 75 years. Chemtrails is part of weather modification and weather warfare.
I have examined critically and unemotionally and I do not find it easy to dismiss.
Well said. These are definitely more than just ice crystals. Again for some it's easier to dismiss them than to think this could actually be going on.
So, let me see. The world has become more industrialized with more technology exploring the skies ...
....
...
therefore chemtrails?
sure.
cognitive dissonance is a powerful thing
Nice post. And you're entitled to your opinion. But the evidence that these, as you call them, contrails, are indeed chemtrails. Most people would rather deny them than face the awful truth that they indeed are real. Contrails disappear very shortly. These chemtrails linger for hours. There is a difference. And as far as the argument goes, oh we breathe the same air so they surely wouldn't spray toxic chemicals on themselves. Do a search on chelation therapy. There are ways to remove toxic heavy metals from the body. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss something because it's uncomfortable to think about it being a reality. But anyway. I look forward to your reply.
Where would they linger? Wouldn't air currents spread them in an stochastic way? I have trouble imagining a more inefficient way of distributing their "harmful chemicals" over the population they intend to harm; one would think such evil masterminds would have a more carefully constructed plan to avoid contaminating the whole entire world we live in.
Moreover, what is the end goal of this entire process? To what end would they invest such a tremendous amount of effort? What would be their gain from this?
Also, if all scientists are bought so they don't talk about "the truth", how are the supposed damaging effects by chem trails so well established? This would require extensive studies and decades-long follow ups with multiple controls (moreover, who would be used as control subjects, if everyone is being spayed indiscriminately?). This kind of research would be crazily expensive and a logistical feat of titanic proportions, who would be funding or having the manpower to do that?
I said nothing of all scientists are bought. There are scientists out there that have documented evidence of pH changes in the soil and that metals such as aluminum and strontium are responsible. And I never said that there is some evil behind it. I think whoever is doing this has some high minded idea as to why they are doing it. I have my beliefs just like you have yours. But neither of us can say for certain that they do or don't exist. And linger, yes linger. They do indeed spread out with air currents. But when you look or watch them they are still there. That's the definition of linger. Still present. A contrail goes away. You no longer see it. I find it interesting that these trails, whatever you want to call them, seem to be trying to block the sun ☀️. Maybe to save us from global warming. At least where I'm at these trails are usually done in the general location of the sun.
So the technology is patented and people in power are discussing using the tech in the future, you just don't believe it's being done yet? Let me know when they admit they are doing it and then we can all point to skies that look exactly as they do now and say "ahhh now they are doing it."
It's hard to say there is no scientific argument when there are videos such as the following:
https://steemit.com/irma/@citizenpresscorp/dane-with-geoengineeringwatch-org-on-irma
chemtrails =/= geoengineering
this is why i said above. use your head. not your hearts.
I'm referencing atmospheric aeresol injection. You should really give that video a chance. This isn't emotional thinking, there is a rational argument being made that you aren't addressing.
so what's up with the video that makes you so sure that it is aerosol injection and for what purpose?
I'd just watch it. I've watched plenty of content from both sides, and this man Dane Wigington seems pretty credible.
Well this is largely the gist of it. Beyond the scientific evidence there just isn't sufficient motivation for this stuff. However some people just drank too much of the koolaid and can't even be introspective enough to understand why they believe what they do anymore.
I didn't want to get into the details for obvious reasons. I don't believe people who believe in chemtrails can be reasoned with scientific evidence anyways so I tried a rather more simplistic approach.
btw, The title of my post was inspired by your comment on teamsteem's sideways tinfoiled article. I was thinking to make this one for some time now.
"I don't believe people who believe in chemtrails can be reasoned with scientific evidence anyways"
That's not a good outlook. Many people just haven't read the right research or still have questions.
Especially if you believe that geoengineering does occur and have looked through the list of patents that were linked by coolbowser, you have the possibility that they are using this technology for potentially nefarious purposes.
I don't count myself as someone who quite believes in chemtrails simply because I don't know the direct effects of each specific ion on the human body, but I wouldn't deny that there have been medicines, pesticides, pollution, and ingredients that we ingest which companies know have harmful effects on the body and continue to use.
Could these same companies/agencies be putting things in our environment that are taken up by plants/animal products that are sold only to the public? While I believe that people with money and access could be using different products so they don't eat/drink the same things the common people do, I don't know how effective the slow poisoning of common people would be.
So I have lots of doubts on both sides, but lots of people need to be exposed to a wider range of sources so they can better understand the science behind both sides (although you will get a those on both sides who will never accept the arguments of their opponents).
Rationality has a hard time right now. People don't want to hear about it... just look at Donald Trump.
Great post and ideas to think about. I think the goverments lost there creditbility of protecting the people off enviroment hazard because they have been cought lying so many times in the past. Thats why people think of chemtrails as a possibility that could happen.
everybody lies. including private companies.
But I have proof!
hehe :D Its real.
oh you better believe it!
Just recently, chem trails around the world seem to have just stopped.
Your post talks about demeaning people who do not think scientifically, but you make several assumptions that go against known facts. However, going against known facts is what the "settled science" seems to do these days. But hey, if you are in the echo chamber of peer-review, then I guess those pesky facts don't matter.
"seem" - You got it right there.
Don't know what's being sprayed but something is, the trails are different.
Oh you dont? I can tell you. NOTHING.
Its watter. Condensation.
Why are they different?
Planes fly at different heights, in different pressure, different humidity, different temperature. And these things vary a lot, thats why they look different each time.
Have a full cup of scientific consensus.
Right...so we've been looking at these planes fly all our lives and just now they started flying at different heights and under different pressure and humidity...
They don't look different every time, there are two types of trails and one of them has only been around for a couple of years. Couldn't care less about what you decide to call consensus, we're not blind.
There is some truth at the center of every conspiracy...at least a nugget of truth. Of course, this gets taken to the extreme so that people believe it to be gospel (intentional choice of wording). Beliefs are a funny thing. Most things people believe, they have no idea how they got there, it is indoctrination. However, others purposely choose a belief system which, in the end, is something they will fight to the end defending.
As for science, be careful pointing to that. The proponents of what you discussed use science to justify the say way you use it to negate. And let us not forget science was used to prove the Jews were a lesser race and deserved slaughter and that blacks were not as smart as other races. The manipulation of science is age old (and only getting worse).
Many have made a great living off the conspiracy industry. Guys like Icke have been espousing stuff for 30 years. Of course, over time, much of what he says was proven correct, hence it must be a worldwide conspiracy. What actually is happening is a natural result of a capitalistic system gone out of control. Perhaps this is the inevitable end to a capitalistic economy, I dont know. Either way, greed is at the core of much that is taking place and a money driven system results in the "elites" profiting while enslaving everyone else.
Faulse claimes can easily make their way into the mind of the uninformed. Two years ago Ebola virous broke in Nigeria, some people said it was a terrorist attack by boko-haram(nigerian ISIS) and everyone should have their bath before 6am with salt and some said salt and warm water. As i type this now i smile, remembering how funny it was . Salts quickly disappearing in shops and family members calleling friends and loved one to take a "salt bath" before six am. I remember asking my sister what if one didn't do that before the stipulated time, and you can't imagine the scloding i got from her and my mum..but i eventualy didn't do it because i knew from the start that that was a factless information. Just like you said, if it were to be in the air which still circulates, the pepetrators will also taste their own poisoned hands(my people'saying).
I think yhe best way to deal with this form of missinformation is to neglect it because, the more you talk about, the more it gains ground even if yoi are saying against it.
Nice one kyriacos.
@arizonawis
"crystals of water vapor from jet engines" Really?
I would be interested to hear your understanding, or possible perception of this question then. Why would we have "RANDOM" planes going into the sky, and leave a trail of "crystals of water vapor from jet engines"? Yet any passenger plane, or cargo plane does not do this.
Any plane in history has never left this behind, until recent years. Did you know while I was in Mexico, I NEVER saw one. While in Jamaica, I NEVER saw one. Our skys in Canada are littered with them, on a daily basis.
This is not something that takes place all over the world, why would just these planes do this?
I think you have some smoke blowing coming from your story. Thanks for your input, I do appreciate having an open debate or conversation regarding an individuals outlook on a scenario.
Please remember, don't think that EVERYONE that notices these things can be lumped into one type of person. You shouldn't give up on a topic you post, and not state your real reasoning behind your topic. You just gave up and assumed that no one could be reasoned with "scientifically". This makes your story less credible. #justsaying
I find often when people are challenged with a question they give up, and do not give solid reasoning's. Just go with what we were told, because that is how we were raised. Have you ever been to an air show? Have you ever noticed not a single plane has this crystals of water vapor from jet engines, except for when they put our your countries patriotic colours to please the crowd.
The first reports of contrails date back to the First World War, the first photos are from the 1930s.
Right, but do you know the person who wrote that book? have you seen that item that was written in the 1930's? you cannot believe everything you read, i mean really.... even history is a joke, half of it is not true. I have a good friend of mine who works for the news film crew, holding the camera, while listening to the story taken place. he has explained that 90% of the story is removed, and replaced with shock value to keep people interested.
if they were started in the 1930's, please oh please tell me why we have doubled in planes dumping random crap in the sky. Those planes do not take passengers or freight, so what business do they have in the sky dumping such "water".
I suppose this booklet from 1952 was discussing the future? Or sent back in time by the Illuminati time machine? And yes, I own a copy.
If there is anybody who shouldn't believe everything they read, it may just be you.
clearly you took offense to what i was saying, i was trying to make it clear that no matter who actually wrote the book or if you have that particular book in your hands. what i asked is if you knew the person that wrote the book, because honestly anyone can write and publish a book. There's no need to be NASTY
The government, is so worried about "global warming"
Yet we just keep going up into the sky, and spraying more crap up there... It's not just some harmless water crystal vapors, or however you wish to refer too them. You know that saying "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"? Well unless we as society can band together to prove the truths behind it, we just follow the herd and don't pose questions. Because they taught us this from childhood.
When we(muslims) dont cinsider these monsters as representatives of christians,why did world think of ISIS and Al qaeda as our representatives....RIP humanity
A lot going on in the sky i dont like it
It is said nowhere that the elite and their children are living under the same sky that is being poisoned.
Then there is a possibility that they are aware of the chemicals sprayed so they have their own pills of immunity.
Maybe there is hidden land. Everything's possible.
Pills of immunity. LOL. No.
Impossible to prove what you can't know.
They could all live on an island as far as we know.
There isn't a barrier between that island that would stop air moving between there and the mainland is there though
Why wouldn't there be?
Because magic isn't real.
What is real and how do you define real?
There are substances that can be taken to remove metals from the body. Chelation therapy is one method.
I take note of the sky's where i live and it's quite concerning that i see these trails criss crossing the sky above me. They then fan out and block out the sun. The main stream media and government wont talk about it so i guess there hiding something.
cant say....
@loku
Great one @kyriacos !
This is the fact
Good information nice post good job
What always struck me about chemtrails is how inefficient of a conspiracy it would be if it were real.
I really enjoyed reading your post and how you put that. In short, 'please do think reasonably during at least a minute'. Thanks!
I saw no reason in putting up the scientific evidence for this since clearly the opposing side doesn't care about evidence.
Totally. I have actually given up for a long time arguing with those guys....
Nice post @kyriacos. Make another one about 9/11 "conspiracy".
You really believe there was no "conspiracy" in 9/11 attacks?
I dont have enough information to decide myself, thats why I rely on investigative journalists and scientists. And their consensus is mostly in line with goverments claims.
I would advise anyone not to belive or not believe, rather to look what indipendend investigators say.
If you want to argue with you beliefs, we can talk about the giant spaghetti monster - our true lord and savior.
You still have to believe what investigative journalists say.
No I dont. Just like with bitcoin miners, the consensus is the truth. Unless the consensus changes, the truth remains.
You are mistaking trust with belief.
I don't see how trust and belief does not go hand in hand.
Blockchain consensus is based on indisputable math, which is hard logic. Human events on the other hand are subject to irrationality and emotions with consensus being just one source of evidence also highly vulnerable to fallibility. Slavery was once considered ok by consensus doesn't mean that its true.
Scientific logic is based on false, unless proven otherwise.
Ok, lets say I believe in scientific consensus.
Isnt that, generally speaking, much better than believing in minoritys opinion?
Their main claim "Jets fluel...." is pure bullshit on par with "Climate change is a myth."
"Slavery was once considered ok" - are you sure it was the scientific consensus or just general population?
Do you accept the mainsteam narrative might be true?
Scientific "consensus" is not always better than the minority position. Consider geocentric vs heliocentric universe theories. What you believe to be "the truth" is then only dependent on the majority, which is then dependent on the time you started considering the debate.
Consensus does not always equal truth, sometimes the majority is wrong but the truth does not change. So I just think your wording is wrong. You could say "the consensus is what I trust; unless the consesus changes, my outlook remains the same." But the truth doesn't change with however many people agree on it or not...
I stopped reading after first sentance, because it shows you did read what I wrote.
How do two planes take down 3 steel framed skyscrapers?
How does a man on dialysis living in a cave half the world away, using windows 98 and dial up get NORAD to stand down?
Why was there molten metal in the pile for a couple months afterward?
How can a plane crash and leave no bodies or debris?
If it was 19 Saudi's, why attack Afghanistan and Iraq?
How does a paper passport survive when the plane, people, concrete and steel cannot?
Cell phone don't work at altitude today, http://wqad.com/2014/04/15/how-and-when-cell-phones-work-on-an-airplane/ how did they work at altitude 16 years ago?
This is a really interesting interview that addresses multiple angles of the narrative. Has some good pictures to support his explanations as well.
@kyriacos Thanks for your work sir.... Love it. Followed
Great post and I wish steemit had a sticky or pin option because this is one of those special posts. Followed.
You did well in your writing this if your only goal was to be a spoon stirring the poison. Good job get others to reply
So you haven't heard about China, Russia, Saudi Arabia governments admiting it ? And the private companies selling it ? Even for weddings... it's trendy now. Genocide you know ?
Contrails mostly don't occur those aren't contrails, they may seem like it...
"High bypass turbofan engines don't produce contrails"
@kyriacos Interesting Tale. Hope you obtain what you would like from this job. Have got a pleasant working day..
After reading through all the comments, what struck me was not one word mentioned about the 95 millions barrels of oil burned each and everyday.
Much of that in jet engines of airplanes.
Yet the discussion is about chemtrails.
Similar the the GW/CC debate where the masses of people are distracted from the real health and environmental issues of petrol consumption.
We are all very addicted to our petrol use and do just about anything not to confront this issue.
It all largely driven by media, controled and owned by big corporate interests
Cargo ships are the worst. There are about 20.000 of them around the world and they use unrefined dirty oil. Approx. 200 of these ships pollute more than every vehicle on earth combined.
I took this picture. A fast airplane left a black contrail - I had never seen something like this before, so I went back inside to get my camera. Then another airplane followed with an "ordinary" white contrail in the exact same path before I could take the picture. Something is going on for sure.