Followed. Liked. Upvoted. Resteemed. Read. Understood. I love peace through strength. Now, is the Non-Aggression Priniciple the same as pacifism? Should we become monks and live in towers up in the sky and only come down once a year? I choose to be aggressive sometimes. I believe in aggression. I understand people who DO NOT believe in starting the aggression. But can aggression be a form of discipline and correction towards your children or students as parents or teachers? I believe in smaller government. I may even consider becoming more like an anarchist. I believe in capitalism. I love money. I love freedoms. For the most part, I do not try to be aggressive towards people, but I make exceptions like you said above when you mentioned the state and also religion.
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Hi Joe. Aggression is the initiation of violence, so if you didn't start it, you're not being aggressive.
The NAP isn't about withdrawing from society, just the state, which loves it when you confuse the two.
I don't believe corporal punishment qualifies as aggression, for example. There's still plenty to disagree about though, as @piedpiper has mentioned.
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I think I agree in the NAP in withdrawing from the state. I think that is not a good enough strategy for making the world better or anything good. I know that corporal punishment can be a dangerous thing to do, especially when the government becomes too big and too corrupt and everything. It might be different if government was perfect enough. I try to tell myself to focus more on grace over justice. So, my definition of grace, mercy, kindness, agape, may include the NAP thing. I love the justice thing which involve wrath and revenge and giving people what they deserve and all. But as I get older, I start to consider more the opportunities and potential of a focus on grace.@mattclarke, agreed, I believe in not starting violence, physical fights, but some would argue and say that Trump Tweets caused terrorists to kill people. I hear the left on CNN and all over blaming Trump for what he said. They said Trump was too aggressive. There is physical aggression which involves violence. My dad was always drinking when I was a kid. My dad was verbally abusive. My dad did not hit my mom but he was yelling. So, I have those memories.
Glad to see you're taking steps to avoid inheriting your Dad's temper.
My old man is a really good example to follow, and I see how easy it is to act like him. If he was a bastard, I'm not sure how I'd go fighting the urge to emulate.
Keep up the good work.
Good. Thanks. Agreed. I do not want to invade or conquer people.
yeah, if you treat children like property that you can hit, you'd be a contractualist at the top of the compass.
It's an interesting premise. Do you have anything more in-depth on the different extremes? I'd like to read up on it.
@mattclarke, Pied Piper is downvoting my posts. He uses aggression against me. @piedpiper is attacking me. He said that discipline is bad. He said discipleship is bad. I agreed with him that abused is bad. I agree. Assault is bad. Murder is bad. We agree but he continues to attack me. I am not attacking him but he is abusing me. He is trying maybe rape me.
Yeah, you guys are just going to downvote each other to oblivion.
You're calling him a fool, on his own post. That doesn't work here, and will cost you money.
You want my advice? Go do pretty much anything else, instead.
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Matt Clark, I took your advice. I LEFT. I WENT ON. BUT HE WENT TO MY STEEMIT PAGE AND DOWNVOTED MY POSTS. He is stalking me. He is assaulting me. He is spamming me.@mattclarke, I did not downvote him. I am taking your advice. But I wanted to tell you this before I left. @piedpiper said he was against aggression but then took aggression on me. He contradicted himself. He said that hitting children is abuse. I say it normally is and we should not hit children in normal situations. It should not be the normal thing to do. I said that there are some exceptions. He does not like that I believe in exceptions. But in generality, basically, I agree with him in a general way. But now he is downvoting me.
Yes, it's a bad place to make enemies. Respectful disagreement seems to go down okay, but you've said some pretty inflammatory stuff about him.
Downvoting you costs him voting power though, so I'm sure he'll stop when he figures you've learned not to start trouble.
What happens if you don't hit children?@piedpiper, I like all four corners of your game board.
If you don't hit children, those children won't be hit by you. Neat, huh? ;) Rather than obeying an illegitimate authority figure out of fear and learning that might makes right, they'll follow your example and seek your guidance voluntarily while learning logic, critical thinking, negotiation and creative problem solving skills.
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Kids do better when they learn critical thinking and everything else from people, especially from their own parents, and the sooner the better too. Kids do better, I agree, when they can have better examples and everything from people and especially parents.
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You need to hit people something. It is very important. That does not mean it is a fear thing. It is a love thing. Please reconsider this thing. When you do not hit, bad things happen. The whole thing is not a simple thing to describe. There might be exceptions.@piedpiper, children do not always and only directly do from and by and through imputation from what they see parents and others do. The world is not that simple and I know people want to blame the parents and others and say that is how it works but this is not how it works and it is not that simple and we can do our best to help children but we cannot guarantee outcomes because destiny are ultimately up to each individual and person and kid.
No, hitting others is never love. It is assault. It's very simple.
@piedpiper, you live in a dream world that is incomplete. There are books and documentaries and people and evidence and prove and so many people and many things and history and psychology and theology and anthropology and sociology and culture and demographics and the DNA / genetics / genes and many things disagree with what you are saying? Deep inside you know I speak the truth but you were lied to about these things and you have held to your way of thinking concerning these things for so long but there is a world out there beyond your horizon and it involves LOVE NOT FEAR.
@piedpiper, what you are saying is dumb. You are very mistaken. And you refuse to listen. You are so closed minded and that is very sad. You are too stubborn. Parents should hit kids like you.
No, the NAP isn't pacifism. It allows for the use of violence as long as it's strictly defensive... and no, hitting children isn't defensive.
Correct, in the NAP you do not escalate a situation. You can meet force with equal force, self-defense.
Great post by the way piedpiper - UPVOTED :)
@kencode, Pied Piper is downvoting my posts. He uses aggression against me. @piedpiper is attacking me. He said that discipline is bad. He said discipleship is bad. I agreed with him that abused is bad. I agree. Assault is bad. Murder is bad. We agree but he continues to attack me. I am not attacking him but he is abusing me. He is trying maybe rape me.
How can you discipline children without enough punishment and motivation?
If there is no punishment, then why would a kid stop doing bad things?
Some kids are different and may need different kinds of punishments at times.
Some kids are well behaved like more often while others not so much.
Discipline is something we develop for ourselves, not something to do to other people. Children are naturally curious and interested in learning, growing, and becoming adults already. They don't need motivation to do that. There's no reason that that should turn out the way that their parents want them to. Obedience isn't a virtue and children are not property. They're self-owning individuals like you and me. They can choose their own paths in life and it's not our place to force them down other paths against their will.
Agreed. I agree with those things. I am not talking against those things. The story is a longer story than that. Many people do not let children ask enough questions. People should let kids be kids more. We should let kids have more freedoms. We should let kids explore more. My mother taught me at home. The way my mother helped me changed as I got older. The way my mom helped my siblings were different at times. Different kids are different. We do better when we cultivate strategies towards helping the youth. We learn at different speeds and in different ways. Children are better off when they are more curious and when they are encouraged to be more curious and to work on their projects at their own pace and everything. I agree with all of that. What I said before is not about this. It goes way beyond that. There are so many opportunities for children. When I was ten years old, we had a camcorder and we were making movies and videos. I was also building things with wood. I would take apart electronics like my older brother. Life is full of adventures and that is great. And by the way, parents can also reward kids. You can tell them good job. You can take them out for pizza or buy them gifts. I agree with that too. I will probably write books about these things. I would emphasize on rewards. I would focus more on that and things like that first.
joeyarnoldvn- Are you familiar with peaceful parenting (sometimes also referred to as positive parenting or gentle parenting)? If not, I highly recommend that you look into it as it addresses the questions you’ve raised here.
It’s a more constructive method of parenting, whereby the parent learns to be more conscientious in their own modeling behavior when responding to their child; identifying and addressing the underlying needs of children that may be driving their behavior; guiding children with proper coping skills and problem solving skills (while still setting healthy limits), and how they can be applied in future situations; and most importantly, creating a foundation of trust, connection, mutual respect, and empathy with your child.
Rebecca Eanes has written some excellent books on this topic (‘The Newbie's Guide to Positive Parenting: Second Edition’ would be a good place to start), as has Dr. Laura Markham (‘Peaceful Parent, Happy Kids: How to Stop Yelling and Start Connecting’) who has a wonderful website filled with useful information & tips: www.ahaparenting.com. I hope you’ll check it out. :)
Peaceful parenting does not always work and there are problems with it.
That's an assertion without an argument.
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@piedpiper is pretending I did not make an argument and is therefore trying to discredit what I said. History is on my side. He can say that is not an argument. That is not relevant because truth does not have to be an argument to be true. It does not matter if you like what I said or not. Human nature is not governed externally. I do not make you into the person you are. You make yourself into the kind of person that you are for the most part. @piedpiper What I said is true. Peaceful parenting does not work as much as you would like people think it works. Sadly, it is not that simple. You need to think about this. You are ignoring so much evidence and so many things which either makes you a bad person or very dumb for ignoring the world and the history that will show you what happened and is happening.
History is on your side? History is full of violent people that think that hitting kids is okay, just as you do. That's not the world I choose to live in. I only allow peaceful people into my community and our children will never have to fear violence from us. They'll grow up in peace and love and won't turn into adults like you that use violence to force people to obey them.
@tmendieta, I love "PEACEFUL PARENTING." I do not disagree with that. Please think about that. People thought I disagree. I do not disagree. I love those things. My parents did those things and I do those things. I agree with you with those things. Thanks for writing. Thanks so much.
@tmendieta, Pied Piper is downvoting my posts. He uses aggression against me. @piedpiper is attacking me. He said that discipline is bad. He said discipleship is bad. I agreed with him that abused is bad. I agree. Assault is bad. Murder is bad. We agree but he continues to attack me. I am not attacking him but he is abusing me. He is trying to maybe rape me.