And the biggest loser is ...... Communists.
Communists have killed an estimated 100 million people.
Nazis killed an estimate 11 million people (non-combatants).
So are communists 9X as bad as Nazis?
Of course not. Ridiculous comparison.
The short answer is BOTH communists and Nazis are deplorable.
These two groups are the real deplorables (that Hillary failed to identify correctly).
This is one of the few times when it is OK to talk about people as a group and treat/characterize people as a group.
Nazis are deplorable. They should be called out and their ideology of HATE should be refuted at full force.
Communists are deplorable. They should be called out and their ideology of HATE should be refuted full force.
Yes, antifa (communists) are the moral equivalent of neo-Nazis !!
Washington Post, Aug 30: Last weekend in Berkeley, Calif., a group of neo-communist antifa — “anti-fascist” — thugs attacked peaceful protesters at a “No to Marxism in America” rally, wielding sticks and pepper spray, and beating people with homemade shields that read (I kid you not) “No Hate.”
Antifa is the alt-left. Democrats don't say anything negative about this violent communist group, since they want the votes of these far left wing violent thugs, in the next election.
Where is the outrage that the Democrats will not denounce the left wing violence of antifa? and denounce the left wing violence of Black Lives Matter?
Why doesn't the MSM push every Democrat they interview to denounce the left wing violence of antifa? and denounce the left wing violence of Black Lives Matter?
Simple answer.
The Democrats and the MSM are in bed with antifa and Black Lives Matter. By being silent and complicit.
They need the votes of these far left groups so badly in the next election, that they can't denounce them.
And this is entirely visible to the largest group of American voters that exist. The 80% of the voters who are solidly purple and solidly in the center of the extreme dangerous nonsense we see at the far alt right and the far alt left.
I trust that the American voters are noticing as the Democrats and MSM are standing by silently, just watching, doing nothing, saying nothing, and ignoring the violence that is sweeping the nation on the left, from antifa and Black Lives Matter.
Don't be surprised when the left doesn't get back into power in the next election.
The average American voter doesn't want and can't tolerate the violence that the Democrats and MSM now represent, through their silent and complicit support of antifa and Black Lives Matter.
The chickens will come home to roost for the cowards on the left who won't denounce violence. Or are too scared to denounce violence.
Wait until Americans get their next chance at the ballot box. Very few will vote for cowards.
STEEM On !!
DaveB
p.s. there were two side in Charlottesville. Both sides were ugly and need to be stopped.
Some content from sources below, with video from youtube.com:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_Communist_regimes
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2011/03/10/hitler-vs-stalin-who-killed-more/
Any extreme is bad. Both ultra-left and ultra-right are equally dangerous.
Full upvote. The obvious right answer.
Interesting that not many are able to get to that obviously correct logical conclusion.
It's not the left/right axis that matters as much as the liberty/tyranny axis.
I am so surprised , first when I read , I thought in my head.. of course Nazi. But the numbers tell a different story . Killing is killing . People should stand together in times of need . They should not sit quite and ignore what is happening right in front of them. Then how can we even blame ??
Rage built inside me with the disabled guy facing that. He didn't choose to be that way
Reject all totalitarianism. And watch out for the totalitarianism wrapped in the Stars and Stripes, imposed by American cops and soldiers.
The disabled guy is an American vet, who sacrificed for his country so that others would have privileges, like freedom of speech, that many parts of the world don't.
Antifa can't win on the basis of the superiority of its logic or history. So it resorts to violence to try to shut down freedom of speech
Democrats are going to pay a political price if they don't come out and start to loudly denounce antifa.
Americans are not going to tolerate any silent support of violence, for folks that stand by and watch without speaking up
The ballot box isn't a solution. Politics is the problem. We don't need politicians of any stripe.
Precisely, it's a big stage show to keep us focused and occupied on irrelevant things while they rob us blind.
Wrong
Thank you for your well thought, informative and constructive post. I definitely learnt a lot.
Did you read the subthread below you?
No
read down below right beneath you
@davebrewer can help you as well
Wrong
You just need to start electing the RIGHT people and get JUSTICES appointed. Get Shelby overturned, get citizens united overturned, get democracy back to being about the constituents.
And how's than been working out for the past couple centuries? Democracy is not virtuous.
You know why? Because Conservative media panders out to cinics like yourself to spread misinformation to make fewer incentives to actually go vote.... HMMM I wonder what mechanism helped incentivize voting? Maybe VRA??? When was that overturned??? Oh yeah, in SHELBY.
Your cinical "Oh voting is pointless and voting is dumb"
is the EXACT narrative that keeps you being a non voting sheeple as elites slowly shift money upwards. You know why democracy isn't "vitruous" as you are complaining it to be? Because you and every cinic about democracy is refusing to vote and spreading toxic misinformation to also drag other.
YOU HAVE TO VOTE! EVERY TIME! EVERY ELECTION!
You can't just wait for the national election to start whinning that you can't get your way! You have to actually vote in local and state elections (you know, the ones that start pooling people for electors???).
YOU HAVE DEMOCRACY AT YOUR PALMS AND YOU REFUSE TO ACTUALLY GO OUT AND USE IT
Then complain that it doesn't work???
VOTE! EVERY! ELECTION!
Vote for candidates that are willing to make the election on a holiday. Vote for candidates that promise to fight against citizens united. Stop making this a choice between "two evils" and start bringing in options that are actually good at every level.
Voting is usurped authority. I do not have the right to govern you directly, so how could I have the right to delegate such rulership to someone else by any process whatsoever?
You are too theoretical. Practical issue - how would you provide for the common defense? Or is it going to be every man, woman, and child for themselves?
If it is everyone for themselves, not much more to talk about. Hope it works out for you, and you never come up against an evil gang that doesnt like the color of your hair
If you agree that we should provide for the common defense, then you need mechanisms to make that happen in practical and efficient ways
hear hear*
You do know it is possible to organize voluntary associations, right? And what military threat do we face that wasn't first riled up by government foreign policy?
WHAT?!? sigh. Some people just prefer to be ignorantly governed and don't want any influence in the government I suppose. Carry on!
Hear hear
Not at all. Some of us reject the presumed legitimacy of government outright. Do you really think a vote every few years gives you real influence? Do you think the authority claimed by government agents is legitimate? If so, why?
I do not have the right to govern you, and you do not have the right to govern me. How can either of us then confer upon some third party the right to govern the other by proxy?
To get the right people elected, we need to take big money out of politics. I can't see any other way. With real anti-corruption laws that have teeth and send people to jail when someone takes money for government favors.
Or just overturn citizens
I think we need more than overturning Citizens United. There has been a long assault on our politics by wealthy interests through the courts. Citizens United was only one ruling. There are about 20 or so that have chipped away at the protection we once had.
I think that an amendment to the constitution is what it will take to make it clear that corporations are not people and that money is not speech.
You can't take money out of politics. Politics is about power, and especially power to control the economy. Take politics out of money, and you have a real solution. But then, there's no point to politics anyway.
No, you can't take money out of politics, but you can take big money out politics to level the playing field. Consider the work of Larry Lessig and his SuperPAC to end all SuperPACS, mayday.us.
Getting big money out of politics is the first reform. Without that, there can be no other reforms.
The power players don't care about such niceties. Driving the bribery underground doesn't make it go away.
And you can't reform a system that was never designed to work the way you seem to think it can. It has always been about protecting the political class and their cronies at the expense of everyone else.
Well, I think we can find some agreement here. To put it in very plain terms, we're talking about self-dealing.
Corruption is an exchange of dignity for money. Money is a terrible substitute for interpersonal skills, too.
The only remedy that I can see is to raise generations of human beings that do not believe in the idea of imposing their will on other people. There's a good book that shows us how to do this kind of parenting: Raising Human Beings, by Dr. Ross W. Greene. It's a book about raising kids, but to me, it's a book about creating a humane collection of human beings that we can actually call civilization.
Hater Dave gettin' his hate on, again.
Nope. Don't think so. Just pointing out that there are groups of people who believe and promote violence. And those types of groups need to be eradicated from civilized society.
KKK is a violent and inherently evil group that provide no value to society, should be obliterated. Do you agree?
Nazis are a violent and inherently evil group that provide no value to society, should be obliterated. Do you agree?
If you agree that these two violent groups should be obliterated, why wouldn't you be willing to extend that thought to violent and evil groups from the left?
You apparently don't like democracy. Certainly not perfect. But I haven't heard of a practical better alternative.
Strawman argument
strawman
You discredit all your previous and future arguments, when you resort to using strawmen as a basis of discussion or debate. Sad.
It's not a strawman argument, it's an analogy to point out the hole in your argument. You appealed to the status quo and your personal incredulity as though it constituted proof that democracy was a good system.
Simple, when the Second World War ended the Nazis ended up as a political force, so anyone can accuse them and no one is going to defend them.
But the Communists continued as a political force, so in some way or another their atrocities have been defended by some idiots.
There approach and methods are being promoted and used by antifa. Not just defending the theory. They are out in the streets rioting and causing violence, in the name of their communist cause
Americans have killed more
References or data to back up the assertion? Kinda sitting there looking bald, like a bald assertion, without any reference material
Lol, those "no hate" signs while beating people up, is like the biggest denial ever...
Most people will notice that dichotomy, and realize someone isn't telling the truth about motivations
So true. The greater someone is in denial, the more it shows...
Nazis are more evil because:
There is no winning by trying to label one group as "more evil"; when both groups are totally evil.
The point of the article is all groups that are violent and spread hate are evil and need to be eradicated. We don't have to try to put a score on the scope of evil.
And for consistency, this policy needs to be applied equally to groups on far left and on far right
So did communist regimes.
You have to be the stupidest person alive.
nazis killed 10million people and were wiped out long ago.
Commies have killed 94million and are still around killing people.
You dont think commies engineered violence and cruelty against anyone who opposed them?
No wonder why you are flagging my anti pedo rape posts and claiming actual quran verses are just nazi propaganda.
Fucking kill yourself ignorant fool.
totalitarianism vs liberty - nazis and antifa are quite alike in many ways.
Yep. You win the prize for understanding what the post was about. Many seemed to have missed they key point. Glad you caught it. Gives me a bit of hope that my writing can be understood by at least a few.
And 100 million is a very conservative estimate. Some estimate that 100 million are "just" the people killed in Maoist China, with 30 million in Russia, millions in Ukraine, one of every four Cambodians, and the list goes on. Real figure might be 135 to almost 200 million. This number might go up soon in the US and Canada if people don't learn anything from history.
Are you feeling good after reading some of the comments on this article, that most people are going to be able and willing to learn from history?
Some people are confused, can't blame them, I was shocked how late the truth about certain things got to me.. can't underestimate the reach of media manipulation, it is extensive, global, it reaches into every school, most households through TV, and a big chunk of the internet is controlled in the same way (Google is 80% of global search volume and we all know what their agenda is!)
In fact, Steemit is not a good gouge of how messed up things are, most people that come here are already preselected for being more inclined to peek beyond the veil. The average Steemit user is not the average human being, or the average internet user. Thanks for upvote brother.
America is also responsible for numerous atrocities, and support of genocidal regimes from Pol Pot to Pinochet. Millions of innocent civilians have been killed needlessly from US backed interventions.
I don't buy collective guilt. The politicians who gave orders and the goons in the police and military who enacted those orders bear guilt, not an abstract concept like "America."
good post, but we also shouldnt forget that the USA killed also 25.000.000 civilists since world war II, that´s 2.5XHolocaust. Just every killed human being is a tragic loss and the 25.000.000 million deserve the same media attention than the victims of the Holocaust. Everything else is propaganda brainwash. p.s: big pharma kills about 50.000.000 worldwide every year due to sideefeects of chemical pharmaceutical medication and vaccination.
There are many deplorable people in the world. I think that most are influenced by hate and greed. Hate begets hate and greed begets greed so it's a never ending cycle until someone steps up and breaks the chain.
I know who you all should vote for in 2020.....
PITCHFORKS AND TORCHES 2020....
Both sides are fucked.
No politician is going to "drain the swamp" for the people....
They want you distracted so they can stay in power and rob us all...and the extreme left and right are falling for it...
I say to both sides....
DRAIN YOUR OWN SWAMP !!!!
Governments kill the most people.
Because they have all the weapons. I am really starting to hate the robot arms race between Russia, US and China.
TODAY ON CNN....
AMERICA ..... WE HAVE PROOF...(that we cant show you because its classified) but we are telling the TRUTH (CIA pinky swear)
And you saw it ..A RUSSIAN named SETH RICHov hacked the election ...IT's TRUE!!! Apparently these russian hackers call themselves LOL TROLLED!! AGAIN WE HAVE PROOF... we will stand by the documents that we distributed to (mis) inform you of THE RUSSIAN THREAT (ignore that we have put a missile shield right on Russia's boarders)...
THEY are the AGGRESSOR you saw what they did to our "moderate" rebels in SYRIA (that we funded) ...They HAD NO EFFECT against them!!!! (once the russian left) they are taking ground...It's obvious it's a plot to fool you but we are SMRTER than they are....A UNNAMED SOURCE (made up) FROM THE CIA HAS CONFIRMED TO US...ISIS ON AND HAVE BECOME MODERATE RUSSIAN HACKER ISIS KILLERS.... (fuck we need a war to cover our interest of a stolen economy)...please anyone?
IRAN? Im fucking shooting at your patrol boats within your borders.... come ON lets fight!!!
NORTH KOREA??? You think you can shoot your 2 megatonne fireworks at us? Ours are bigger (100 to 500 mega tonne) and we should get together and we can show you how to REALLY brainwash your people better.
China????? you trying to steal our racket???? You guys and your gold backed currency and your total financial dominance using a stupid idea.....being fair???? ...HA YOUR DOING IT WRONG.....hahaha Why don't you go to your island (that we should have thought of but couldn't do because we were to busy stealing taxpayers money). WANNA FIGHT????? COME ON !!!! FIGHT ME BRO.....don't look at wall street crashing and people rioting .....MY EYES ARE HERE....FIGHT ME BRO (before it all comes apart and people realize what we're doing....)
I CANT HEAR YOU OVER THAT EMERGENCY BROADCAST BULLSHIT SCREAMING.....
FUCK TAKING SHELTER MOTHER FUCKERS, IM AMERICAN AND WE DON'T BACK DOWN FROM NOBODY!!!!!!
AM I FUCKING RIGHT AMERICA????
****uuuhhh sounds logical to me....oo new IPHONE 9 super cool!!****!
THE END.
Here comes another right winger ready to blame Dems for the fringe movements rather than taking ownership of the rise of the Tea Party and their influence in radicalizing the far right into hijacking ACTUAL REPUBLICAN BELIEFS in the name of "Conservativism"... You're pathetic.
There were many attempts by MSM to claim that Tea Party was violent. But they could never find any proof. TEA party was motivated to try to reduce taxes and starve government. Violence was never part of the TEA PARTY mantra or make up. Tea Party was soccer moms and blue collar folks who were tired of getting screwed over by high taxes.
The radical violent right has nothing to do with Tea Party. KKK, Nazis, and similar violent alt right groups were around long before TEA Party.
If you really believe that the Tea Party was what radicalized the far right, you don't have an understanding of history before the Tea Party, and you dont understand the Tea Party.
No way to have a useful conversation when you don't have same understanding of the facts.
I will continue to blame the growth of antifa and BLM violence on the left, if the left doesn't step up and speak out against that violence.
Dave, dave, dave. You are missing the point. The Tea Party never started violent. They never wanted to be violent. They simply became paranoid. After they got paranoid, fringe right joined the Tea Party as a petty attempt to punch the Overton Window towards the right which is why AntiFa grew in US to counter it.
Stop blaming MSM and stop getting your info from unverifiable (by years of constitutional law) sources. Internet media, like the internet itself, is in far too much of an infancy to even remotely be warrantable to be the "high ground" and if you really wanted to stick it to MSM, you would be trying to reform it through demanding higher standards.
You know, like not havign a monopoly controlled by the Sinclair group?
Squirrel - look over there. Let's talk about monopolies. Your attention span is not real long.
Let's try to focus. On monopolies. They are bad. One legitimate role of government is to shut down or break up monopolies whereever they can.
We agree !!! YEAH !!!
Now let's see if you can focus for three questions:
Simple questions. Should be easy to answer
14 88
This post received a 3% upvote from @randowhale thanks to @davebrewer! For more information, click here!
This stuff is hard to watch. I felt like practically crying seeing that disabled vet get water poured over him like as if he's some trash. It makes me so sick and so sad that this is going on. These people seem so brainwashed, and depraved of any dignity and respect for fellow human beings. Very ironic given their name and what they keep shouting at people. From all of the videos and everything I have seen over the past year with these "anti-fa" aka pro-fa types is that THEY are the fascists. THEY are the nazi's. THEY are the ones that are racist. THEY are the real cowards through their words and actions, and all the more signified by them hiding behind their masks. They are very terrorist looking and I don't get the point of them doing that. Many of them might be paid off by globalist types trying to cause chaos and division where there wasn't any or little of it before. I wouldn't be surprised. From everything I have seen they hate humanity and they hate America. End of.
Duh Einstein, the guys at the pro-Trump Republican rallies with the swastika flags are the real Nazis.
you realize there is video evidence, included in this post, that directly matches with the points kouba01 made.
and all you have is ?????
Did you notice that the article said Nazis are bad and need to be obliterated?
Is your point that the Nazis were bad, and therefore that justifies antifa violence?
At some point logic will have to intrude on your world view
Who
Should have compared this with the Roman Catholic Church!
Compared to the Catholic Church ???
No thanks .....Then there would be more of this.....
I don't even have words for that!
How about south park is awesome....lol
Hey you, habla Español?
yeah, I am fluent with google translate :)
No seriously my Espanol is mucho limited, college was a long time ago!
Duh! Those guys marching with the Swastika flags at the Republican Trump rallies are the Nazis. Not Antifa.
you watched the video in the article? easy to make unsupported claims about swastikas. the video is harder to deny. I promise i didn't make the video from scratch as CGI. it is real people. real antifa.
at some point you will have to let facts inform your thought process. or not and live in a permanent delusion
Violence can not be justified in any case.
What about the genocide over Native Americans? Including people killed in all war "for freedom" that USA have started, i think we have a winer.
This is a shocking number for me too much killing i hate this
How come when it comes to mass killings, capitalist always gets a pass? The link below is to a calculation of 1.6 billion murdered by capitalism.
http://sayitaintcapitalism.tumblr.com/post/81932846515/capitalism-16-billion-murdered
The list includes both WW1 and WW2.
So that discredits the full list in my opinion.
I am not familiar with the background of every item on the list, but when you put WW1 WW2 on the list, which are clearly not started by capitalists, and were started by Nazis and communists and dictatorships, then not worth my time to investigate beyond that obvious mischaracterization.
With regard to the WWII, it has been fairly well documented that the Bush family, well known and 'respected' capitalists, helped Hitler rise to power.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
With regard to WWI, while The Economist would like to divert attention to the shrill protests of business interests to war, the seeds of war had been growing for decades before then, cultivated by capitalists:
See https://revolting-europe.com/2014/07/29/ww1-100-years-on-capitalism-is-still-the-driving-force-for-war/
I have yet to see an example of a large capitalist country that can thrive without imperialism. Sure, you may be inclined to discount my sources as "socialist", but that is your call. Or, you could try to refute them with other evidence. If you believe that the list I presented is not worth your time, so be it.
I have laid out what I think is a good case that capitalists, through constant and unending need for raw materials through imperialism, have fomented plenty of wars and conflict for financial gain at the cost of more than a billion lives. I can't stop thinking of DeBeers on this point.
I think no one politician are responsible for that huge number of killing because nation all over the world want peace but that crazy politician just for own benefit push us and imposed the war
The order followers killed all those people and most of it was democide (killing of their own population)
Just doing my job, just following orders. Today that sentence is still used as an excuse but it's never valid as an excuse i.m.o.
Most people are killed by order followers. Just doing their job, just following orders.
Congratulations @davebrewer! You have completed some achievement on Steemit and have been rewarded with new badge(s) :
Click on any badge to view your own Board of Honor on SteemitBoard.
For more information about SteemitBoard, click here
If you no longer want to receive notifications, reply to this comment with the word
STOPMost are not aware of the Gulag and how many tens of millions (60 million estimated) that were killed there. Stalin had genocide down to a science.
Politics is the main problem . . . . We don't need politicians. . . . We need honest man .
You are really wonderful continued
Always in her creativity