My story with STEEM started from the very beginning, I created the photography category in the first days posting was open, back then there was no reward or anything, but still I posted some photography because I like it and I liked to share it here, everyone liked it back then from the devs to the big guys no one was complaining about it, they thought it was good for the image of STEEM to have diversity in the posts. None of the photography I posted was my own, but I’m a long time photography enthusiast and I have an eye for it and know where to get good photography with credits. I did what I do out of love for photography and this project.
Months passed, all was OK, then after STEEM went big, things started to change, aggressive people started to show up out of nowhere trying to dictate what I can and cannot post, trying to bully me out of posting photography and videos I liked with all kind of claims, from copyright complete non sense claims, to plagiarism to content not being original and all kind of excuses. But the real reason is jealousy and envy, those people thought that they can also determine how much a post can get, they did not like it that I got votes and they did not.
I tried to explain my point of view, tried to reason with those people but nothing could be done, their hate was blinding them, and they were determined I should abide to their orders and be a good citizen.
This weekend things escalated, I have been slandered, defamed, threatened in posts and also in the slack police channel. I tried to respect people and discuss in a civilized way, but my fate was sealed.
I made a photography post today, in which I only posted my own text, and public domain photos, but it was too late, it was blindly down voted to oblivion by the blind hearted people and reported as plagiarism as well.
Worst is I was slandered again in the slack channel after coming to a gentlemen’s agreement with them, and some hateful people even contacted ned to un-vote one of my video posts he had voted for (which he did obviously because I’m the bad guy now, not like the old days!), they also contacted some of the people voting for my posts to stop doing it which they complied to under pressure.
Where was it written that only original content can be posted?
Who has the right to decide how much reward a post can get?
Who are you to tell people how to vote?
This place is starting to get worse than Reddit, with thought police, mod squads, astroturfing and fear mongering.
Finally, I would like to defend those of us who like to post stuff they like, even if they did not make it, it’s a right we have by all laws of the universe. This place will turn into a compilation of mugshots, and low quality content and articles if it is forbidden to also allow external content, it cannot survive!
Thank you for making me hate a place I once loved!
My view for what it is worth, is you're curating photographs and people are upvoting based on your taste and judgment.
The only people that have grounds for grievance are the copyright owners of the photographs.
There may come a time when many of us will be required to seek clearance for the use of photos. We may be pursued aggressively, maybe not. I'd advise everyone that lifts (non-public domain) photographs from the internet to set aside a pot of money to deal with these matters.
Some claims will be dealt with as fair dealing. Some claims will require authors to cough up cash. Other claims will require authors to take down material and damages may be sought. These are the realities of copyright clearances.
Outside of the copyright owners no-one else really has grounds for grievance. Unless they feel you were misrepresenting photos as your own. From what I can tell you have always attributed the photos appropriately, so there should be no issue on that score.
Just my two cents worth.
Hosting plateforms are legally liable for the content they host. Steem is the hosting plateform and we are its stake holders. We are entitled as a community to decide what kind of legal exposure we want to subject ourselves to, and it only makes sense from both an economic, business, legal and ethical perspective that we do not encourage people to seek income from the work of someone else by violating their intellectual property rights. Note also that although Steem is decentralized, Steemit Inc is a US registered company and they are the ones who will be spammed by DMCA take down notices if we allow the IP rights violations to go unchecked.
Steemit should look to how YouTube and other hosting companies deal with copyright infringement. There is no need to reinvent the wheel here I think.
The copyright owner should make a complaint (for all we know @masteryoda may have obtained the requisite clearance) and then the material can be blocked until the matter is resolved (@masteryoda should be given the opportunity to refute breach of copyright claims).
Persistent offenders who receive numerous complaints from copyright owners should be put on a banned list.
Steemit Inc. has clearly attempted to provide for this in the Terms of Service:
I would hope (as a quasi stakeholder myself) that Steemit have sought the best legal advice available. Copyright infringement can become a major headache for a platform like this (I've worked in this field for over a decade). It shouldn't require community policing beyond blatant false attribution.
If we are reliant on the community to police copyright infringement we are pretty much screwed as that approach is not scalable.
How do you remove copyrighted material from a blockchain?
Is that even possible?
You don't. But you can remove it/ stop it from showing on the Steemit site (which is a view of the blockchain data).
You can actually post things like youtube videos and such. They encourage linking and embedding because they still get to run their ads and get ad revenue, and that is passed onto those artists who monetize. That does not apply to static photography though.
Sure, you could do that if you wished. But this is a different kettle of fish. There are people with videos online that would be livid if they found out someone was linking to their video in order to profit from it. When someone copies someone's video on YouTube, the original owner can file a complaint. If someone here embeds a YouTube video it might only result in 20 views, for example, and amount to nothing for the YouTube channel owner, but 20 upvotes from whales here could net that reposter thousands.
Why can't we simply face the fact that we are trying to make money off of others work because we think we can get away with it?
At the very least when embedding a video it would be nice to put a link to the channel, mention the channel's name or something. Very often people won't even do that and end up giving the impression that the video was created by the Steemit.com poster.
This is why we need to have some sort of best practices mentioned for people so that this site will be better than any social media site out there.
If the political will is there we can do both. Be HUGE and make a ton of money and disrupt the heck out of the internet AND do it in an ethical way that will put other troll-riddled sites to shame.
Nah, never mind, I'm too idealistic. Keep stealing others content, who am I kidding?
@doctorstrange - We hit the nesting limit I think. I have added extra info besides just linking the video. I have only shown one video per artist I have shown in most cases, and actually the one I MADE money on was the first one. I actually sent a message via youtube to that author telling him about this site and stating I wouldn't do anymore for awhile as I'd like to see him here doing it himself. Yet that was my single most profitable post and he has a lot of material. I didn't post any of it beyond the initial to mostly raise awareness. I am doing a HIDDEN GEMS music covers and such series (only one post so far) where I'd like to occasionally point out cool videos of musicians that have low viewers. I'm still trying to find a balance which I believe all of us are. I'm pretty familiar with youtube monetization since I have actually gone through the process before.
EDIT: I also stopped posting and worrying about money. If I make money cool. Usually I don't.
We DO know that he didn't get clearances. He already responded that he never contacted any of the original websites, YouTube channels or photographers.
I agree. Which is why we need to establish best practices ASAP as to what is going to be acceptable before everyone feels that "sharing" others content in order to make profit on it is the way things are done here. It's obviously going to be a huge problem going forward if there are a million users "creating" content to profit from by merely copy and pasting it.
Seriously, these sorts of issues need to be hammered out now so that the platform doesn't hit a wall it can't climb.
You can define it as a problem or you can be realistic about it, but not both. There will be a million users (if we're lucky) sharing content, just as there have been on every single social media site in the the history of the Internet. That's what people do. It will need to be addressed by copyright holders making takedown requests when they object (which isn't always), just as it is on every other web property.
Except - too many of Masteryoda post I've seen are someone else's curation.
Going to another person's website and copy and pasting their curation, isn't curating.
For example here's a Masteryoda post and here is the post where he selected 5 photos from someone else's post
The photos posted are amazing - YES. But unless masteryoda runs Avax someone else put in the hard work putting them together and writing up commentary on them.
Curating art IS a valuable skill people SHOULD bring to steemit.
Art Gallery curators do a real job - and there are virtual equivalents to that. Sifting through the mountains of material available on the internet and bringing quality content to the fore, even if it is not your own original content is of great value.
But copying other's curation is no different than copy and pasting a Buzzfeed article in my opinion.
If @masteryoda was transitioning to doing more actual curation with his platform that would be great, in my opinion. But selecting photos from Avax posts alone personally won't get my vote (not that it counts for much).
People are free to upvote, but people are equally free to draw attention to 'copy and pasting' and let people choose to NOT upvote.
Thanks for sharing this, I did not know this to be the case.
Looking at the example,
(from an attribution perspective) @masteryoda did credit Avax, however I think he should make it clearer that the whole post (including the text) was an excerpt of the Avax article. This isn't obvious from reading the post. I wasn't aware of that fact before, so thank you for bringing it up.
(from a copyright infringement perspective) again, it would be for Avax, to lodge a complaint about his use of extracts from their article was a breach of their copyright. As well as possibly the whoever owns the copyright in the photos raising a complaint.
Except for a couple of things. Steemit.com is not the New York Times or YouTube.com. Nobody at Avax is aware of Steemit.com yet. And none are aware that their article is being profited from. Someone here could have contacted Avax and said, "Hey did you know...", but nobody did that. We brought it to the attention of the fellow community member and let them know that what they were doing was not kosher and that they should do their due diligence of contacting the source and getting permission. He elected to hide behind "If they contact me, we will resolve it", of course knowing full well they would not agree to it if they were aware.
I really hope that @masteryoda can know in my heart that I wish no ill will and that even though it must feel like everyone is jumping on him, it's understandable why you felt it was ok to do what you did and nobody is blaming you for it. It's just that now that you know it's not appropriate, to just change your procedure to one that is more time consuming.
If you don't want to do it the right way, we all can understand. After all, if it was as easy to do as what you were doing.... everyone would be doing it.
Agreed. I would say generally there is not a huge issue at the moment from a copyright perspective because attribution is being given (although it is probably a grey area).
He didn't always give attribution, that is more recent. I'm not mad at him for past transgressions, and applaud him for changing to at least giving attribution. Just correcting you on that point so you can more accurately assess the situation.
And again, as far as putting the burden on the original content creator to seek damages when the content user is making a profit without the consent and having made no effort to contact the content creator for their permission is obviously a way to roll the dice in order to make money in the hopes one doesn't get caught. Just because someone isn't aware of a crime doesn't mean a crime wasn't committed.
Some photographs are public domain, some are expressly free to be used, others are expressly determined to be never even photographed (in the case of something at a museum for example) and nearly all other photographs are automatically copyrighted unless expressly determined to be otherwise. You don't even need to put a copyright next to it, but people on the internet. Just.don't.care. Because they want to make money as quickly and easily as possible.
Your standing up for him has earned you 1700, congrats. this further proves my point that as long as you support the whales positions you stand a greater chance to gain a financial reward Which is not to say that I don't think it's perfectly fine to get that much for your comment. You created your comment yourself, it was useful, helpful and worthwhile. Please don't read me wrong on that account.
are you angry or afraid because your content is someone else creation?
he is non of the above. it is just an observation.
Very good points.
Your two cents is worthlre like 5 hundred bucks =P
I know you are upset - you are completely right to be. But please don't give up. You have been one of the few valuable contributors to Steemit. You are among the few dozen people I follow.
Steemit is still in beta. We should expect trolls, bigots and nastiness. We should expect unfairness. I'm confident things will even out on the long run. These miscreants will be driven into irrelevance and will give up.
Of course, there will continue to be problems, but on the long run, I think Steemit deserves a chance.
If you are really upset, perhaps you can take a break and come back a few months later when the platform has matured. But then again, we need steemers like you to make this a solid community.
Yea, it would be pity to see you leaving! Really, maybe just step a few days back from you computer ...and the coming back . Also if your decision is finally, i'm understand this, it would be just pity.
Don't leave but let's make your voice count - and let's make steem better with such input and feedback!
Yes, I do hope @masteryoda returns after a hiatus. We need more steemers like him - whom we can always trust to contribute good content - to make Steemit better!
@masteryoda
I am adding to my follow list! I dont mind a good repost. Its hard enough to find good material let alone totally original material direct from the source. YOU HEAR THAT MR. COPYRIGHT? Leave us alone!
Please, do not leave the community. Probably the majority of people such as you describe them, but there are also quite adequate people. Do not be excessive perfectionism about Steemit. It's just another social platform, which is a bit of a perfect being
Where did all the whales go?
you mean these guys? I got them all.
more whales die here in Japan
hail japan
The community can be strong only by having strong people within the community. Steemit always needs people who are dedicated to making it the best it can be.
Who is the boss? 370 for 14 votes... Dizzam!!
I will contribute gotten rewards of my comment to @masteryoda
After u got some break - come back and man .. u shouldn't care about naysayers and complainers .. i know this is somethings a though thing to ignore .. (i had to learn these lessons as well over the past 3 years)
Seems like someone stole your post and is begging in posts to upvote it.
My post with the beg in comments https://steemit.com/steem/@steve-walschot/what-steemit-really-is-all-about-now-stop-complaining (dont know how to link directly to the comment itself)
And the user stealing your post is @angelinaalba
I've read and upvoted your post earlier today, that's how i spotted it was a fake duplicate.
Hey so I appreciate everyone's time and I understand where YOUR coming from, but I was wondering does Steemit want to be known as JUST a blogging site?
Check it out and please let me know what you think..
https://steemit.com/socialnetwork/@stealthtrader/does-steemit-want-to-be-known-as-a-blogging-site
You guys are so funny. Why does @masteryoda's voice count but all the people who are talking about inequality doesn't?
333 dead...
@masteryoda we all need to find that spot where we could change this world to make it a better place to live in. i support you on this but you don have to stop. we dont quit, we only get better. Some steem tuna also cautioned me on a post that was clearly not my own video but posted it as with acknowledgement in the hopes of sharing it with other people because i found it to be helpful. I tried to explain only to get flagged down losing my rewards but hey i could not get any worse, i accepted it, and here i am trying to do what i love doing here on steem, to post great contents, engage in intellectual discussion, to ispire and motivate others to do the same... your among the gems of this platfor, you dont have to go away... pick up your self , continue to add value and move us with your great works.
I seriously cannot agree with you more, summon. Steemit is still an experiment in beta stage. There are obviously flaws in the system fundamentally.
But quitting does not help. Really does not. It would mean that you'd be missing out on everything that this community is striving to achieve in the future.
But again, as summon said. It's your choice eventually. And we can't stop you from quitting.
It is a true pity.
Thank you, you made it count in an amazing way, I’m really thankful!
Does similar posting on Facebook result in law suits for profiting billions upon billions of dollars on copyrighted material? I don't think so, this is social media on the Internet. Everything is linked together, you can see the source in the URL and everyone has the right to carry on a public conversation. Most content authors are happy to have people discussing their work as such on Social Media. I agree, the only person who has a grievance is the original author of the content.
It's not the same AND just because other sites get away with it to some degree, doesn't make it ethical or legal to do. In this particular case Masteryoda is directly profiting without the permission of the original content creators.
If the original content creators were asked ahead of time by @masteryoda "Hey, would you mind if I posted your pictures on my blog and if I make any money on it, can I keep it all for myself?" do you think any of those professional photographers would have agreed to that?
He is hiding behind the "if they original content creators have a problem with it they can ask me to stop". Well, this presumes they can ever know that one has stolen their content and is profiting from it or not. By the time any of them find out, and I doubt any of the owners of the 100 or more links that have been used are aware of their content being profited on are, @masteryoda would have placed the profits away in bitcoin or elsewhere and how does the original content owner verify how much exactly was made? "What the hell is a Steem???" they might say.
Just be honest and look at what has been done with open eyes and not make excuses. This is ill-gotten gains, plain and simple.
How do you know @masteryoda does not have the rights to use the works? There is royalty free for example in several media types like photos, music and video.
If @masteryoda is breaching copyright, then the owners have recourse through the law, Steemit does not need vigelantes acting as judge, jury and executioner.
Definitely. It happens on YouTube, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram - on all social media. Content copyright owners notify the social media websites, and they have no choice but to remove the offending content. In fact, YouTube even has automatic detection of copyright content under pressure from the movie and music industries.
I LOVE this.
This is a very big problem with community in steemit for now.
Unluckily,you get money here,and other people can see how much you got it.
That means the envy and jelousness is getting to work,and changing people.
They hate seeing you posting new,great photos (like u did already,i have really enjoyed watching them!) and they are saying it is a plagiarism and reporting you just because of a simple reason-they know you are going to get money from it.
However don't worry my friend,steemit is upgrading everyday.
We got BETA now,so you need to wait some time if you are not alright with posting new photos now,i would be happy if you do :)
Post photos of work you have rights to post, simple as that. It puzzles me how people want to make excuses for this sort of behavior.
Yes, this. We are not pleased that someone is getting money for nothing. It is not RIGHT! Pay the original content creators, get their permission, or don't use their work for your own profit. How in the world is this unreasonable to ask?
You @hrottie are getting rewarded for creating your comment here, and even if I were to think "This person is getting rewarded for doing nothing! They don't deserve that!!" I would never downvote you to try to take that reward away, because you created that original comment yourself and people democratically voted on it because they agreed on its worth. In the case of @masteryoda, he did not create that work. They posted content that belonged to someone else and based on this copied content was rewarded for it. If there were no pictures from others, he would have made no money. So who should the reward go to? The person that used someone else work to then make profit or the person that created that work initially? This is not only common sense, it is law.
Just because you and I like the pictures from others that he posted, doesn't change the fact it was an unethical thing to do.
Now Masteryoda is aware of this fact so can no longer feign ignorance. I hope you and others rethink this situation clearly instead of jumping to his defense without weighing the facts.
Steemit.com is still in it's infancy and NOW is the time to set our best practices in order to make a strong, vibrant, FAIR platform for sharing content. It is in all of our best interests to get things done right from the start instead of letting something fester on and on and then having to try and remedy a situation that has grown out of control.
I hope all of you that are jumping to Masteryoda's defense can see that it's not about envy, it's about what is best for the platform in the future and that we care strongly about Steemit.com being a success. Condoning theft of others hard work goes against that success.
Cheers
It's sad to see there are so many deaf ears here. If any of these people were photographers who had spent their own time and money creating work which was then used by others to profit I think they would change their opinions.
It's also sad that they are getting at least one whale up-voting their misinformed opinions. This only serves to encourage it.
@ned and @dan will need to deal with this sort of thing sooner rather than later or it is likely it will be seen as tacit approval for law breaking. The Feds love going after anyone who breaks copyright law particularly if there is money involved.
That would be a disaster not just for Steemit but for the whole cryptocurrency scene in general. It would generate more bad press and confirm the public perception that these sorts of things are "shady" and used only for crime.
Sometimes the sophistry is so strong that it overpowers reason.
Thanks for being logical.
I seriously and earnestly tried my best. Spent many hours trying to show our side of the issue over the course of a week with evidence and attention to detail, and it all fell on deaf ears.
If I would have instead posted one comment in support of @masteryoda I could have made $400 on one post, but instead I stuck to my principles in support of those of us that have a different opinion and was rewarded with derision and maybe $15.
It is very disheartening to say the least.
And thank you immensely for suggesting my posts are logical and promote reason. Those are two of my over-riding principles to live by. I go wherever the strongest arguments take me. Usually. However, I see where I went wrong in attacking the problem as we saw it on Steemit.com. I thought others could be swayed by reason and facts and a sense of doing what is right. I was naive and I've learned my lesson.
I've given up, for now, on trying to explain the inequities of the system as we see it and to get replies from those that feel there aren't inequities in the system. The power of money and it's affect on free speech is so clear and demonstrable, it saddens me that so few can admit to it publicly. Understandably so, but unfortunate in any case.
Thanks again Positive, and anyone else that appreciated what I was trying to do and say here.
Cheers
That is a really, really bad place to be, if your posts on Steemit are fueled by jealously or envy.
The only way you are going to create good content is if you write what you believe in and do your best. The rest is not in our hands.
Exactly. We are not here to hate. We are not here to envy.
We are here to express what we love, and what we are passionate about.
I am new to steemit, but I hope this will be a place were enthusiasts can share what they love without being judged all the time! I'll give it a try!
Are posts like his expected to become as valuable as they once were? Possibly more?
Steem is a permanent record of content creation stored on a blockchain and real money is involved. People are going to get upset, envious, be offended, and experience all sorts of volatile emotions. This is like reddit + FB but with bigger stakes. So if you want to thrive here in the long term, you're going to need to have thick skin, stay positive, and adapt to what comes your way. Ragequitting is an unprofitable and unproductive strategy. Whinging is the same. I hope @masteryoda doesn't leave because we will be worse for it. And so will he.
@liberosist is absolutely right. Don't feed the troll @masteryoda . We are in beta, many nasty people who think better than the others will come. It is normal here on the Internet. But communities tend to balance, and these people or get tired or no one ends up voting for them.
They only win if people like you let them free path and leave.
I agree with you - Do not give up.
A little patience, my dear friend. All will be.
to @masteryoda :
At the moment you have: $109,527.02 on you wallet... stop complaining.. all of that and more you probably have already withdrawn was make almost on 3rd party work, meaning, other people lost time and gave their most to create something. You pick that in seconds, compile and profit....
you should be ashame of this post, it's insulting for all, sorry to be so direct.
don't be a dickhead...
It feels like certain people are being discouraged to post while others post and get upvoted for posting crap. Wish there was something we could do immediately.
i wish the same too. so that good content will prevail and the bad content will die
I hate to say it, but it's almost like we need to make people pass a test before joining steem.
In school, we are taught all of the most basic rules of publishing, such as grammar and how not to plagiarize. Do we need steem to test us on what we learned before we post so that it can remain a civilized place? Don't people know they shouldn't plagiarize, and how to refer to things in a way so it's not plagiarism? This is ridiculous.
Thank you for your support and kind words!
Nobody wants you to leave. I have zero animosity towards you and while I can't speak for anyone else, since I don't know what is being said in Slack, I can only assume nobody else wants you to leave either.
You have to understand that I come from a background of graphic design/illustration/photography and know what it's like to have others profit from our hard work.
I can see it from your post that you feel everyone is jumping on you, and that must feel awful. Please know that I have nothing against you personally and quite frankly don't know anything about you. I can only hope you will accept my apology for any unhappiness you feel based on anything I've ever said or done here. That certainly was not my intention.
Sincerly
So good to have you back, @masteryoda! :) I sure hope you continue posting some good stuff as you were.
The biggest issue with steemit, from what I can tell, is that delivering value is not the same as getting value. The interests and people that are rewarded here are VERY narrow and seem to be more about whom you know rather than what you write. And sometimes it's just random. I saw a post that was "I'm skeptical about getting paid" - like 3 sentences of this, and it was over 1k in rewards.
There are plenty of vastly more valuable posts for the community here getting like.. 20cents. This is defended by posts about how the "whales" are choosing what will be big to bring in peope.
But if you LOSE people then you have to bring in even more. I expect steemit to get flooded for a while, then "churn" will be HUGE and it won't matter. Just a flash in the pan.
This is the beginning of the churn. If the main thing that gets money here is praising steemit and boobs, then expect it to just become a soft porn site powered by bitcurrency. The worlds first digital strip club? Groundbreaking, I guess. But probably not what was intended.
Regarding the variety of content, a fair point indeed. I see lots of great content in niche topics go completely unnoticed.
I suppose that's just a result of it being a brand new platform. I bet these things balance out as Steemit becomes popular. To be fair, Steemit developers are on it - the hard fork today adds several measures to improve content.
i see no rules no where :) i just see steam power
I agree that on introduce yourself could be misused. because I think the anonymous online world, so privacy is maintained.
Tomorrow things change,the excess will be filtered out ,and the mode is still Beta.
I completely agree) I will read intetesting people that they engage favourite work
Hello masteryoda!
These things (trolls , etc) are bound to happen as the site is in a constant state of growing. Don't let this drag you down and continue making posts and pictures. You should just post what you like not what others dictate you to do , because everytime will be that "one" guy who doesn't like you and he will keep trolling you until you give up.
I am a new guy here and I just start to better understand the site and I your post have good value , so to me that is a sign to never give up.... only one time you can say things are bad and that is when you post something here and you dont receive not even one single vote or a comment ...or at least a dislike (that flag button) . But this is not a case for you so keep making pictures and post any content you like!
Donald Trump is the culprit
@masteryoda, hello. These people were and always will be. Don't pay any attention to them. Because more than 500 people voted for your post ! Most of us support you! It's great!
masteryoda, do or do not there is no try! DO what you feel you need to. As long as you are giving proper credit to the creator of the work and citing your sources that is absolutely not plagiarism. ZERO, it is totally legit! DO NOT fear fair use. It is extremely complex. It is very important that Steemit.com, is allowed to be a source information and to be an aggregated news source. This is an enormous source of traffic and every social media site depends on it deeply. I know your intention was to share cool stuff, to spread the word. That is called the NEWS. A completely legit form of fair use. As long as you are not just using the images to make your post look cool, as long as your post is to pass along a bit of news you should be good to go.
"the fair use of a copyrighted work, including such use by reproduction in copies or phone records or by any other means specified by that section, for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright.-socialmediaexaminer.com"
Reproducing digital images is allowed, make sure to use a lower resolution image than the original work. This helps protect the curator from being threatened with copying the work. Again always site the source, provide a link, and credit the creator. It will also help the case for any news article to add some of your own critisism and commentary along with the transmitted material.
All the news channels and other social media sites make buko $$ from passing along news, so I suspect the Steem we receive is not really the problem.
Obviously I am not the even close to the final voice on this. That said, I do support you and I support others as people work to figure out how to safely present sharing cool stuff on Steemit.com. I say safely beacause due to plagerized work and improperly credited shared items, Steemit.com could face serious legal problems and the site could even be taken down. Which would SUCK.
-Peace
some easy links for fair use information
http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com/copyright-fair-use-and-how-it-works-for-online-images/
https://www.rivaliq.com/blog/guide-copyright-fair-use-laws-online-images/
http://guides.library.ucla.edu/citing/fairuse
also a link to a post I made a week or so ago about a question I had regarding fair use
https://steemit.com/steemit-issues/@darkb4dawn/copyrighted-material-and-fair-use-on-steemit
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Nice touch @darkb4dawn to include links explaining the boundaries. The fact is, the online world can be pretty cruel sometimes. The anonymity protects our privacy, but also provides us the power to engage in bullying without consequences. It can't be helped. Engaging them would be totally up to you.
I get where you're coming from @masteryoda. You like photography and you like to share it with everyone. That's all well and good, especially if you abide by fair use. There would be no harm done, and you even make money on the side. But, as a poster of original content, I see where they're coming from as well. It's hard to see that re-posts earn more than your carefully thought-out original work. That's just the way it is currently. Until the creators of Steemit enable creators to show off their original content for an amount of time so that many people would take notice, posters would just have to market their work more heavily. However, bullying is not the way, and there are better avenues to convey their stand.
For now, you just need to solidify your choice regarding the matter. Stick with Steemit, earn some money on the side and face the criticism, or just quit and call this a learning experience. Just get along can't we all?
As I see it there should be just one simple rule for situations like these: If the content is not yours, give credit or original link, and that's the end of the story. Users can upvote, downvote or ignore it - but they will know whether you made it or someone else did.
That's not the end of the story, though.
Say someone makes a post praising my photo work which includes my photos in it. Fine, thanks for the praise, but if your praise racks up the equivalent of a downpayment for a home and outranks any money I made on it (since I was who put the effort into creating it in the first place), how is that fair? There needs to be some sort of system in place that rewards the creators in those situations. If it wasn't for them, the creation would not be there to share to begin with.
Hmm, people are making money out of reviewing videogames on youtube, if you see people making money on your work on steemit, wouldn't this give incentive to the content creators to join Steemit themselves to reap the rewards? I like to see the best material on Steemit, just like on reddit people are posting stuff that they haven't created, but think other people would like to see. Maybe, if one were to say, post someones photograph, he should inform him about Steemit and link to that post just to see what the platform is all about.
If Yoda is posting beautiful pictures to this platform for people to see, I say let him. There are people who go to photography just to watch beautiful pictures. But there should be information about the origin of the pictures and link to creators other stuff/website. I'd also like them to be informed about Steem, if possible.
I'm sorry, but that doesn't sound appealing to me. That feels like someone stealing my car, then selling it, me catching them, only to end up being given a business card by the thief and being told, "Hey, if you ever want to get into selling cars..." Doesn't make sense. What if the content creator isn't interested in joining? Continue letting people on this platform reap the benefits of that creation?
Your car is a singular object that can't be duplicated - I don't think that's a fair analogy. A better analogy would be something like: someone stole my song when they downloaded an mp3, then selling it, me catching them, and forcing them to remove it.
It happens, right or wrong, and digital content rights are a huge struggle for society right now. You see the entertainment industry fighting it as hard as they can right now. The real question is what happens when steemit gets a DCMA takedown notice for a post in the blockchain? How does that get removed?
I think seeking permission should be required. I'd be curious to know how many yes answers you'd get.
You still have your photograph, you are getting exposure for your work, suddenly you find a new venue to profit from your work if you choose to do so, if not someone else will keep posting your good work, making more people aware of work. I could see big content creators eventually making accounts to steemit to battle someone else profiting from their work.
The law allows "fair use" - so when reviewing a videogame, you can use a single screenshot and it will represent 1 second of the game and is deemed fair use.
Similarly with writing, you can quote a small snippet the size of those blurbs you see in the search results, and it is deemed Fair Use. If you quote the whole thing without permission, it is THEFT under the law.
And with photos - by definition you are using 100% of the original creator's image, unless you are only posting a snippet of the picture from the top corner. Under the law, this is theft, which means that the owner has the right to pursue you and force you to pay damages.
In such cases it may depend on the copyright or other license that the original content is provided.
By default in the US, at the moment of creation, copyright belongs solely to the creator unless sold. Granted, to further strengthen this, you would want to register your copyright.
This is correct, but it does not require that the copyright owner enforce any or every instance where the work is used. It is up to that party, and that party alone, to decide whether, for example, getting exposure on the Internet via social media is a net gain or a net loss. No one can legitimately impose such a decision on the copyright owner.
Obviously though, the platform is global, and not all territories share the same laws attached to content. I think it's a good sign of "maturation" that we've started discussing ethical and legal implications of steemit posting rules. What I'm currently thinking is the extension of these legal implications: Say an author wants his copyrighted text removed from the blockchain, what then... (I'm not mentioning photographs, because these are typically hosted elsewhere). Who's gonna do it if the platform is decentralized?
Interesting times ahead....
No reply button for you. But I agree. Definitely interesting times. I feel a new kind of common sense for this type of platform will probably develop. There will be some kind of overall rule for copyrighted content. Obviously, as we can see in our discussion, varying opinions abound. There should be some kind of reconciliation.
We don't need to be told that, even! It's general courtesy to leave a credit at the end. I credit even when the source is a public domain gallery or something.
Seems pretty easy to me.
Here is a new type of post about my first salvia trip man please check it out and let me know what ya think :D
https://steemit.com/new/@stealthtrader/my-first-salvia-trip
@masteryoda, you had interesting content, and personally I don't care where it was taken. I think those who started this movement against the deployment of different content just jealous.
My friend, do not treat it so. Keep it calm post. If they you put for this ban. Then let them put it to me.
I understand the frustration. But i think steemit grow way faster than anyone could imaginate. This comunity is sky rocketing an ppl dont cant hold on from the growth. I like that peaple are cool to each other and calm down. Nobody should attack another steemer. We ned to stay together, to make it as great as possible.
Keep up the good work, and dont blame your self :)
Have a nice day
Me too
Here is the problem. Some people don't care about stealing others intellectual property. They apparently never had a brother or sister take their toy when they were a child or never created something to know what it feels like to never get paid for their services then get to see their image used on an album cover and never get their original art back which was part of the agreement. (That's my story)
It's me me me, they want everything for free or they just don't care about others for some reason. I honestly don't understand how some people think it's fair to use others works and make profit on it. It simply makes no sense.
Can anyone please post something justifying what has been done by @masteryoda without just saying "I liked what you posted, so you're cool in my book!" or "Everyone is just envious!" (please stop using jealous all the time, it's not an accurate representation of what you intend to say)
These are not reasons to allow this to go unchecked.
Please present references and links to show how it might be appropriate to copy and paste other intellectual property on a website and profit from it. It's really simple. Then this could all be done and we could all go our merry ways.
@summonerrk I would said that if you had made a ORIGINAL post on steemit and it had made only 2$...
then someone picks and steals what you have CREATED, and posts on his blog... he's well known so the upvotes keep comming and he mades 2000$ on that post he stole from you...
Now... can you truly say "I don't care where it was taken"?
Don't think so! I'm a designer and a creative, and my intellectual and physical things (either real or digital) are MY OWN property, if I post credits on an image and someone removes the credits and uses, he's stealing, simple as that!
Meanwhile, your content made $0.00 for telling the truth and the original comment made $400.00. This further drives people to want to only say positive things in the hope of getting a sympathetic whale to upvote the comment, further driving away dissenting views.
@masteryoda, don't give up! A good platform and good posts bound to have challenges. Keep Steeming and all the best to you!
I agree with pinklee.
I have seen Lunartic running around Down-Flagging, for no reason. I got down flagged!!!!
Anyway , keep up the Good work with the photography.
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
@masteryoda, its a bad news from you...
STEEMIT developers is not DECIDED at start - this project will have free content, or only original.
And now you is victim of this. But we are with you, dude.
This is a very big problem with community in steemit for now.
Unluckily,you get money here,and other people can see how much you got it.
That means the envy and jelousness is getting to work,and changing people.
They hate seeing you posting new,great photos (like u did already,i have really enjoyed watching them!) and they are saying it is a plagiarism and reporting you just because of a simple reason-they know you are going to get money from it.
However don't worry my friend,steemit is upgrading everyday.
We got BETA now,so you need to wait some time if you are not alright with posting new photos now,i would be happy if you do :)
I have been a steemer for over a week now. It was a very hard week, with ups and downs, with dreams and burns, launches and crashes. With only a handful of hours slept and cringes and blood-shot eyes. It was crazy and by the end of the week I also said: THAT'S IT, i'm deleting all my posts and moving away.
But this morning, after a good night's sleep I might say, I said NO, I WON'T GIVE UP. I don't care if my posts never reach the Trending page, or not even the Hot page. I believe in Steemit, in the idea of Steemit and I am going to keep posting my stuff without thinking about how successful they'll be and how much money is it going to make me. I have ideas that I want to share and if I help only a few people, so be it, I'll post it for them.
With bot lists, employer-employee whale relationships, promoted posts through a closed slack et all I could say I should stop and move on as it's bigger than me. But I won't and it's because of posts like yours that make the community show it's true face, a united face, that acts as one when it's right to do so. I saw the same community towards the end of last week with the responses off one of @johnsmith's post that went epic and where the comments were better than the article.
@masteryoda: I tell you, don't give up, stay for the people that follow you, don't quit for the people that downvote and collude against you.
Oh the Steemit sleep deprivation... SSD! The comments on that post really showed how much potential Steemit has to connect people. It was an absolute blast to log on and find new comments waiting for a responses, like little Christmas presents on every refresh. There will be growing pains but I have faith, there's a lot of good people here. Steem on!
there is no any luck to me with my posts as well but i'm still here just to see something new. Good luck 2 u, master!)
I'm sorry you had to deal with such hate thrown your way. While you and I may feel fundamentally different about this topic, I don't believe you should have to deal with that kind of BS.
As a rule, I generally feel that the creator of any content, whether text, image, video, sound - whatever it is - should get a fair share of whatever profit is made. Having said that, I don't believe that - in this system - that ONLY the creator can make money from the creation if it can be distributed in a way that benefits everyone involved fairly. When people talk about fair use, I generally like to believe that should also involve fair gains. After all, if something of mine goes viral because YOU posted it, then awesome! I may not have had the influence to make it happen on my own. However, I feel that whatever is made should be shared with the creator(s) evenly.
This post is being downvoted for what reason exactly? While you may not agree with @masteryoda's views nor his conclusions, the post itself is original writing, expresses a sincere opinion, and raises important issues about behavior on the site.
The degree of downvoting on this post demonstrates the level of hostility and negative brigading that is starting to go on here. To those doing it, you have proven @masteryoda's point very nicely. Congratulations to all the bitter people who are seriously damaging what has up to this point has largely been a positive and empowering environment.
I could not put it better smooth, it seems this post touched a bad nerve, that would explain all the flagging and down voting, thanks again for your great support!
I think this debate is blown out of proportion! If someone is sharing my pictures by crediting me for it I'd be thrilled. (Yes I've worked in web and print) Publicity is always welcome! Most people arguing here have zilch experience working in large news agencies/media outlets but have tons of experience sharing legal citations! The masses here need transparency in rewards but they cringe in discomfort when they see big numbers on any post other than their own! We are hypocrites! That's just human nature! We scream Ethics and apply it arbitrarily based on our whim and fancy!
The hostility witnessed on the platform in the past 24 hours is proof that we're here to trample each other, compete by any means possible! We arent here to succeed and help others succeed with us! Steemit is increasingly becoming an outlet to simply vent and rant about each other.
There's an old saying, "When two elephants fight , the grass suffers."
As the community grows in numbers, rising intolerance amongst each other will ruin this place! We must exercise constraint and be more compassionate! Let's think for a moment, "Has this debate resulted in providing any value to the original owners of the content you care so much for or for the community itself?" —The honest answer is Zilch! Nothing!
Those guys are out there creating new content, earning money from it and happy that their work is shared with the world! The publicity generated by reshares of their content is landing them 3x the gigs than they would have otherwise. That's how the real world works off of our computers!
If we feel that we are failing by putting all our eggs in the Steemit basket and deriving less than expected returns its purely our fault!
So Congratulations to all for arguing with each other!! I honestly wonder if we as a community have gained anything apart from negative emotions and ill feelings towards each other from this exercise in futility!
It is blown out of proportion, I see it as a form of fear mongering, all social platforms deal with it, why should Steem be any different. Nice post! Thank you!
@masteryoda stick around man! :)
I agree. I initially downvoted this post by @masteryoda but have removed that after thinking about it.
Whether I disagree with @masteryoda or not I don't think it is fair to downvote him. He has the right to express his opinion even if people don't like it. It is only through discussion that these issues will come to light and be resolved.
We are not all enemies here, we may be passionate and point out when we think people are doing something wrong, but ultimately it is because we want this platform to succeed.
Only through working together can we solve this problems.
100 % of agreement, a thing is that the most valued be the original content, another thing is that it is obligatory. I have seen many of your post and the photographies that you put are precious, even you indicate the one who is the author, about it it treats itself not? Steemit is a social network that values your passions and your interests. Then the people are free to vote or not vote, to comment or not comment, but your also you are free of postear what you wish. (Providing that it does not offend anybody). As they have said to him in other comments , the anger is normal, And you have reason in thinking that there is a lot of envy behind, but also it is necessary to understand that this is beginning and we all commit mistakes, so much the staff of steemit as us, nobody is perfect, It will Be the time the one that puts order in all that.
A greeting and I expect to continue seeing your post!
I would like to thank everyone who showed their support here, I was not expecting my post to spark that much interest and controversy, but I’m glad it did, it made me feel I was not alone here and it showed the power of the grassroots of this community as this post remained on the top of Steemit homepage despite unjust flagging and heavy down voting. I do respect the opposite opinion and I think it’s a good thing to discuss this issue openly and try to find a middle ground on which we can all agree.
Of course I condemn the policing and brigading that’s taking place here, people accused of abuse should not in any way be dealt with that aggressively, some people make innocent mistakes, some are not aware of the unspoken rules, but they are being dealt with like criminals and scumbags as I experienced it firsthand. For the image of this project, dealing with abuse should be done in a civilized way. Of course not all members of the abuse brigade are rude, but a few of them are enough to ruin the image of Steem.
I think we should be able to agree on a code of ethics that needs to be written, because people cannot be held accountable for unwritten rules, I’m not encouraging blatant copyright infringement in any way, but copyright law is much more complex than some people here think. And it’s allowed to use copyrighted material under some circumstances without permission, copyright holders know it and accept it and only a judge can decide if there was an infringement or not, not the average joe.
Regarding the liability issue of copyright, it’s been discussed over and over again, but to sum it up, there is no need to reinvent the wheel here, we do not need to worry about it more than sites like Facebook, Reddit, or Youtube, of course none of these have been taken out because of it, because they have a sound legal policy to deal with it. And that’s what this project needs. Relying on community based brigading will definitely not solve it. It needs to be dealt with using proper legal advice and policy.
People who think I made more than a hundred thousand dollars with my posts are way off charts, I mined and invested in Steem early on, and been running a witness node, that’s what makes up the value showing in my account after Steem price went up ten folds.
For the time being I will refrain from posting news photography until we agree on a code of ethics that takes into consideration the opinion of all people here, not just a select few. I think it’s best because my photography posts have been drawn way out of proportion either regarding them being a threat to the whole site (that’s absurd) or in regards to their financial rewards.
I will however try to contribute in other domains I excel at, that are not subject to controversy, it have been overwhelmingly encouraging that people here supported me, and I will not give up so easily.
Once again, thanks to everyone who made this post count!
This is the hard way ! We love you .
You have made a very interesting post. As a conservative estimate, probably 99.9% of the users here are unfamiliar with the very earliest days of Steem where we were discussing strategies for aggregating content. Most of us thought nothing of aggregating manually and the debate focused more on how to do efficient aggregation with bots.
Now, since the community has grown to include those from all walks and cultures, we are being imposed by a different set of standards. In contrast to the old standards, which focused on technological efficiency, the new standards focus on an unwritten code of ethics, probably because money is involved.
Many users will think I mean that very early adopters don't have ethics, but that's not the case. We didn't have the financial component so the ethical component that accompanies finances was irrelevant.
One aspect that may be very frustrating to newcomers is that us very early adopters still tend to focus primarily on technological efficiency because that is our nature and is a huge reason why we are the types who become early adopters. We also have a lot of power resulting from our early adopter status. It may be time to re-think how we interface with this new community because we have now become a very visible minority.
That's a smart way to put it. I believe the frustration isn't fueled by "ethics" per se. Most people ethics are whack if you look deep down enough. They don't hold a logical ethical system but a "I feel this is unfair" kind of system.
What happens is this: People are outraged when what they perceive as "bad" content rises to the top.
They feel underappreciated and hurt and tend to fuck off.
In a way, this is illogical too! Because their posts are not all that better and anyway, didn't make any money anywhere else! But the $$ sign changes everything right away.
I don't mind a powerful minority that in time will create a powerful majority, but I think we need to be careful about not alienating new users. How exactly, it's an open discussion but one worth having.
For all of us!
Thank you.
Even very, very interesting conversations about aggregating content are also likely out of the scope of what most in main stream will be reading about and contributing their into input and ideas toward.
The technological efficiency standards approach and bots have their place in social media, in the end social media that works is content created by humans.
"Social media are computer-mediated tools that allow people, companies and other organizations to create, share, or exchange information, career interests,[1] ideas, and pictures/videos in virtual communities and networks. -https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_media"
The financial component is what makes Steemit.com, especially compelling for an enormous numbers of users/potential new users. To the deeply interested, the underlying technology, the geek aspect, is mind-blowing. To the "masses" it is 99.9% of the time the financial aspect that is mind-blowing. I certainly can not say that it is unethical to try and make money here, one could argue that is whole point of Steemit.com -----> to finally make money for participating in co-creating in the library of human life.
I believe it is very true that many people actually have no idea what plagiarism is and sharing is just so common that even highly educated types may have forgotten the ethics and the rules. Education can help.
After education there will still be willing abusers, especially while the site is very new. For some people the chance to cash out far outweighs the penalty of being chastised and/or expelled from a site that while very cool to you and me, is possibly disposable to them. Damages done to this beautiful site by these types make us cringe and yet the very willing offender likely couldn't care less.
Decidedly the early adopters and others with large influence here do ultimately have a serious role to play in this issue with you weighty nature. I don't know what is best myself, I do wish you well and will chime in when I have something intended to be meaningful to say.
I wish those conversations/discussions were easier to find, they'd be interesting reads.
In this new unwritten code of ethics, I propose one of the pillars is: the content that the community creates is sacred. It's one simple rule that's always worked for me while managing content based communities.
If you live by this rule, there is no room for error and you need to be certain before you claim something doesn't belong or isn't real. Bots would need to follow this ideal as well, and only respond if they are absolutely positive it violates the code. The content itself needs to be "innocent until proven guilty", and not punished before the evidence is 100% solid. Treating content with the utmost dignity should be the #1 goal, otherwise we will end up alienating content creators, which harms growth to the community.
But... when content is absolutely proven to violate a copyright violation, be completely fake, or violate any of the other ethics/standards - the gloves come off.
Your posts in this thread are awesome. This is concise and true and should guide our approach here:
And this too
This is a very reasonable response.
Early adopters have indeed become a minority in number, but not in power, and with power comes responsibility.
The code of ethics idea is definitely what we need next, but I think it should be written, because unwritten law is subject to subjective interpretations.
Thank you for your support!
@masteryoda: you are overreacting and throwing baseless accusations.
First I'm not aware of any slander having occurred. The discussion in the slack channel was respectful and constructive as far as I can tell. If you feel that you have been slandered, this must be the action of an isolated individual, and not the community as a whole and I would recommend that you settle the matter with the individual in question instead of throwing the blame piecemeal at everyone around.
You are also slinging mud on the curators in #steemitabuse. Are you aware we are spending hours of our personal time to detect and counter spam and plagiarism to keep this website clean and do not receive any compensation for doing this job? I can understand you resent the difference of opinion between your definition of "fair use" and that of the community. But do you really need to belittle the work of tens of volunteers to express your dissatisfaction?
Last but not least you imply that there is some sort of conspiracy that lead to the concerted downvote of your latest posts. This is simply absurd. Look at the votes on your two last posts: as of the time of this post, you have got a single (ONE) downvote on the latest post, and 2 (TWO) downvotes on the previous one (out of dozens of votes), and the Steemians who downvoted you were not even involved in the Slack conversation yesterday. Basically you are crying out because one or two individuals who used to support you changed their mind after your annual smithsonian photo contest post sparked controversy around intellectual property rights and probably made them reconsider their support. Are you seriously thinking it is proper to blame the whole Steem community because you lost the support of two individuals after one of your post attracted a lot of negative attention?
Please calm down and look at things objectively. The situation is what it has always been: contents are being voted based on the aggregate community opinion of the relative value of each post. As any society, the Steem community is evolving and what it considers to be valuable or acceptable changes over time. It's everyone's responsibility to remain aware of societal change and adapt accordingly. It doesn't mean that posting external content has become unacceptable, but obviously awareness has risen around intellectual property matters and it has now become more important than ever to strike the right balance between fair use under the "right to quote" and original content.
I am a frequenter of steemitabuse and as an individual with opinions which were shared there I would be happy to discuss them with masteryoda 1 on 1, but he is not obliged to do so if he does not want to.
Let it be known that I have shared my personal views directly to masteryoda on the slack, sharing honestly and openly things which he obviously did not agree with or enjoy, and did not respond to (he does not have to respond). But that is how life works. I have never downvoted masteryoda nor have I lobbied to have him downvoted. I would not characterize the content of the opinions shared on the steemitabuse slack as slander or hate. Neither would I consider all of his posts as plagiarism once attribution is given. My issue is more philosophical, and I think it has already been said and there's no need to go into it any more.
This is pretty serious accusations you are throwing here. Frankly I don't image anyone bothering to "conspire" about your case, and even less @ned and other whales caving in under "pressures" in particular concerning a matter as mundane as the relative value of your photography posts. Given that you are the one who started to cry "slander" because some curators have dared to challenge you on your definition of fair use, I hope that you have really sound evidence to back your claims.
Evidence > accusations.
Please, please, please, don't let these idiots hound you out; at the end of the day, you presented your posts in a particular way, nicely curated and well thought out.
I voted for you several times and I loved your week in pictures, people were jealous because of the fact you had started something before they were here and they can't handle that fact.
Ignore them, keep posting, if people want to vote they'll vote, the flag abusers are only harming themselves in the long run.
Cg
@cryptogee, yes - posts are great. But @masteryoda is still getting compensated for the work he may not have permission to use. Thats the real issue. @masteryoda, do you have actual permission? Or have you worked out an agreement that the photographers will be getting percentages in a contract? I have been a professional illustrator for over 26 years, and I can guarantee that no other professional artist/photographer would willingly give up rights to their work for someone else to profit from it. I'm sorry you were hounded and berated in the ways you were. At the same time, I hope you will make sure you have full legal permission in writing with terms agreeable to the photographers to post what you do if only to protect yourself from lawsuits.
Producing a great content is not enough. Producer should be able to take crowd's attention to the great content. If he can not to do this, he should be thankful to people, who can do this. And the royalty for producer will be crowd's attention for his future works.
I really hope you don't rage quit. We'd all lose out if you did. I'm really sorry to hear about other conversations that have gone on which were not respectful. For my part, I've really enjoyed the dialog here. Full disclosure, that's my wife's post. Prior to you highlighting it here, it had very little $ attention (even after getting linked to by @anyx's front page trending post). She posted it (and I also got involved) not out of envy, jealousy, or some such thing, but out of a deep desire for justice, fairness, and ethics in the world. There was something going on that not only didn't feel right, it also seemed to go against our current understanding of the law. That, to me, puts the reputation of this site (steemit.com, we won't even get into the blockchain implications of all this) at risk. That puts us all at risk. We've seen takedowns of entire websites because of copyright infringement and those sites may have had no direct financial incentives to those sharing other people's work (like we have here on Steemit). This early on in this experiment, it's important to lay down the foundations which will last a long time. If a respected, influential member of the community like yourself is rewarded for a practice which might increase the existential risk for the entire platform, is that something we should all be concerned about? Others would naturally follow the same practices, maybe not taking as much care as you did to site your sources. It's possible those individuals alone would be at risk, but again, I've seen too many examples where the entire site goes away.
As for those who are jealous, insecure, and petty: ignore them. Their tragic expressions of unmet needs deserve sympathy and maybe a little pity, but nothing more. There are far more people here who want everyone to succeed.
If you feel the need to take down your previous posts to protect yourself, that's an understandable decision. If you do so, I hope it's for your own reasons, not because someone forced you in any way. That, to me, is the beauty of this entire model: no force is needed. Community standards are changing and evolving via conversation. That's a beautiful thing.
That's a funny joke/hyperbole, but it's not really accurate. Again, there's no coercion here. We can act as adults and make our own decisions.
My wife and I were really happy about your last post and how you used public domain images. That, to me, was a great sign of positive change! Curating great content should be rewarded. Just copying a page (from a news site or elsewhere) where someone else did the curation seems less valuable to me (but that's just my opinion).
In closing, I want to apologize if anything I've personally said came across in a rude or insensitive manner. I truly hope you change your mind about modifying all your old content or, if you must, own the decision as your own and not one that was forced upon you.
I hope this will pass, and we can all enjoy great photos from you in the future.
Thank you lukestokes for sharing you concerns here I totally understand and respect them, I enjoyed as well discussing this matter with you and corinnestokes before this thread was posted, it was really instructive, and that post has an interesting legal insight posted by sean-king. I think everyone reading this should go ahead and read it here
Regarding your concern and others’ about the whole site being taken down, I don’t think it’s possible given all legal precautions are taken, like stated in sean-king post. Sites being taken down over copyright issues are typically torrent sites that do not respond to DMCA takedowns and share large content mainly in the music, film and software industry, there is no comparison to be made with social media sites, if so, Facebook, Twitter and all other social platform would be long gone by now.
It’s always a pleasure discussing with intelligent and respectful people like you, I did not take any offence from you or corinnestokes.
Thanks again for your great way of discussing this in a mature and responsible way.
Thank you. :) This comment made my morning, along with my wife. Mature, responsible discussions are what separate Steemit out from the rest of the Internet. I hope you stay for those, if nothing else.
Fist time I hear a whiny rage quit post being qualified of "mature, responsible discussion". What part of it was mature and responsible exactly? The part where @masteryoda slings mud indiscriminately at the #steemitabuse team of volunteers curators because we dared challenging his notion of fair use? The part where he throws baseless accusations against @ned that he still hasn't backed? Or the part where he implies there is a conspiracy against him because he got a single downvote on his last post?
Let's get real people. Payout time is over, you can put down the violins.
Wow, just Wow, your rudeness and hate has no limits. Here's a small sample snippet of some chat that took place in your police channel proving there was conspiracy against me and vote dictating:
xxxxxxxxx [XX:XX AM]
i’ve also reached out to those with large accounts who are voting for him
It seems you did not like being exposed for who you really are.
@recursive: please view the conversation we are referring to here. In my opinion, it was mature and responsible. I've withheld my negative opinions about the rage quit here beyond what I've already expressed. I was not present in the Slack channel when the drama went down. My opinion of masteryoda has been influenced greatly by his actions on this thread (and in general), but I tried to keep my personal opinions separate from the more generic ideas being discussed here and how it impacts the future of Steemit.
Echoing this as it has always been my position on this topic.
Do you really think caps or bold are required here? It's just an opinion among many.
What should or should not be rewarded is open to perspective and @masteryoda has been here much longer than most everyone on the system, given its current exponential rise in new users. That, to me, deserves some respect. They were here before there was a photography channel. For us to come tell someone "You're doing it wrong!" when they defined what "it" is from the beginning could be seen as presumptuous. I hope, for my part, I've not done this but instead participated in some important discussions. To the extent I've judged others (instead of talking about ideas and existential risks for this platform), I apologize.
Obviously it is not required, but emphasis was desired and therefore I chose to highlight the quotation using the ## tag.
Are you arguing with yourself here? Because I simply quoted you directly and agreed with it.
I appreciate your feedback and I've made an edit to the comment which I think highlights the quotation but avoids the unnecessary bolding.
@jamtaylor Perfect! Thank you. I didn't intend to tone police you or anything, but since it was my content, I also didn't want it misrepresented. :)
No, I'm just disagreeing with the use of ##. In online forums, that can come across as yelling and there's quite a bit of emotion in this thread already. What I stated was my personal opinion, and I do appreciate that you agree with it. Having it highlighted so much with a headline setting makes me feel uneasy. If everyone did that, for example, this place would look like a ransom note and become unpleasant (IMO). I'm not arguing with myself, just trying to appreciate all sides of the discussion.
These early adopters aren't perfect. If they are doing something wrong or illegal or even just rubs someone the wrong way, there is no need to censor yourself and not let your opinions be known. It may affect how you are viewed later by those that don't like to be criticized, but we are all long time internet users and should be able to take reasonable criticism, and return comments back without getting our feelings hurt. All it takes is to come from a place of honesty and understanding. There is no need to hate anyone or think someone hates you just because they don't agree 100%.
Perhaps it's a sign of the times as evidenced by how much the conservatives and liberals are so divided, in the case of the United States. Unless someone agrees with everything you say, they are the enemy it seems. That kind of thing should be squashed from the start here on Steemit.com. Everyone, even your enemy, should be able to voice their opinion and all of us should stand behind those who have the unpopular opinion as to their right to say it.
Without being able to question the "superiors" this Steemit experiment is going to fail. Just because someone started something, doesn't mean they infallible now or when they started.
Things that don't get big payouts usually go unnoticed as they also have less visibility. But personally I respect you and your own opinion on the matter, sadly mine in an SEO perspective differs. Clearly for the organic visibility of the platform, others might be jealous but curation is subjective afterall.
I know I also got overly aggressive and we had a big fight on Slack, I apologized to you and publically apologize. After things calmed down and we talked more civilized.
I dont mind people saving things they like on Steem but hopefully we can have boards like Pinterest or similar but no-indexed so Google doesn't look at Steem like a low quality - duplicate content - link farm website .
This is the snippet from Slack after we chatted and I think people should read it before they go on hating you.
" @talerecursion (nickn) @repholder and @anyx explained to me how duplicate text can hurt steem SEO efforts, so I will make sure i'll use custom text because i like this project an i want it to succeed and i hold vests because of that, regarding the photography, i beg to differ, we had a long discussion on the thread below, and even a lawyer pitched in to explain his legal point of view, i'm posting mostly photography that has made the news, so it's kind of news reporting which is accepted under fair use license, anyway only a judge can decide that, not you or me and as the lawyer pointed out, if there is damage done, the party will issue a takedown request to the webhost or steem. As long as the photographers themselves are ok with some of their notorious photos being published all over the web, i don't think it's a problem. here's the discussion:
https://steemit.com/steemitabuse/@corinnestokes/re-posting-other-peoples-photos-videos-on-steemit-fair-use-vs-commercial-use#@sean-king/re-corinnestokes-re-posting-other-peoples-photos-videos-on-steemit-fair-use-vs-commercial-use-20160723t175131893z"
Your a cool guy and down to earth. Here have an upvote.
I mean no offense by this, but from an SEO perspective why should steemit get the relevance for these posts anyways? The content is in the blockchain, it's not on steemit, and it's very likely that the same content will exist elsewhere on some other website using the same blockchain.
As a developer myself I understand why you want as much SEO relevance as you can get, don't get me wrong. It would help steemit grow organically. But you also have to accept that the content on any site site may exist other places and may not be unique. It's not always a bad thing.
Edit: to just close out that thought with my opinion - I don't think absolute copy/paste content is OK, it's kind of spammy and the only redeeming quality it could have is being a backlink. But if you use an asset that you're legally allowed to use (from elsewhere) on steemit, it should be fine, and you shouldn't get brigaded by down votes.
SteemIT is a frontend that is indexed in Google and other engines.
True that the content on any site site may exist in other places, a small detail here is that content needs to have supporting content of your own or it's basically worthless organically.
Sorry to see you go, I loved your space post. :(
Yes, the brigades have formed and gotten out of control in less than 2 weeks. There is an easy fix, if the Steemit website team would just look into it.
The absolute only problem with this type of posting is not crediting the author.
There is a fix for this that simply makes it easier to do the right thing, than to steal. The fix is EMBEDDING content, just like youtube videos are now but for everything, web pages, sound, pics, and video.
Embedding credits the author, provides a link to the original domain, and shares new content. Imaging being able to ethically share any page from ars technica, deviantart, colleghumor, dropbox, instagram, kickstarter, twitter, reddit, soundcloud, hulu, vimeo, ustream, vine, etc...
This fix would allow more content than any social network, and do it ethically by crediting\linking the authors page.
There is even an enterprise level business called http://embed.ly based on this new type of sharing, they turned plagiarism into a legal and ethical business and Steemit could too. Right now, for a monthly fee...
Here is a better description of the open source embed projects.
https://steemit.com/steemit-ideas/@tinfoilfedora/a-solution-to-copied-content-that-would-make-steemit-explode-with-cool-posts
http://oembed.com/
https://noembed.com/
To be the first hard. It is a difficult path. I'm trying to develop an idea of goodness and charity on STEEMIT, because I believe that in the future he may become one of the best places for this. I don't need no glory not the money. But I was constantly trying to blame my dishonesty. I understand you Master. We have to fight. Look at all these people for you. Continue.
fuck me sideways!. this gif is amazing
@masteryoda I don't know if you remember our Slack conversation, but basically the conversation was about how I wasn't able to pick up any traction and you said something along the lines of just post what makes you happy. Well, my next post I did, and it hit and it was entirely about just posting what makes you happy, I am pretty sure it would have kept going if the site had not gone down 2 hours after I posted it. Like many others have said, maybe you just need a step back, you are an inspiration to many here and nobody wants to see you go. just my three cents.
I totally agree. #decentralized means that there is no authority that orders people to obey their rules.
This is decentralized social media and we are #free.
#love each other, don't #hate
While the blockchain may be hard to censor, frontends to it (like Steemit), which essentially are just companies running a website, are not. Just wait and see what happens, if they start getting a shitload of nice, fluffy DMCA requests for copyright violations. This is not the 1990s. If copyrights are beeing violated, things tend to get ugly very quick nowadays.
This is one of my favorite posts ever, because its so honest and raw. EDIT: I have withdrawn my vote because I am boycotting support for all whales.
I uploaded a couple of videos and photos myself, trying to be succesful like you and get some bucks, obviously nothing happened and i only got some cents from them, but i dont hate you for that. its just luck i guess. People's lust for money is driving them insane, dude. if you make 2k per post, i truly feel happy for you, i dont understand whats going on with all this hate against the trending posts. Keep doing your thing, i enjoy the photos and videos that you share
It isn't only luck, it is consistency and reputation. @masteryoda has been finding and sharing great content for months and has developed a following. If your content is excellent as his has been, then you can develop a following as well, but it takes time and persistence.
you're right, cant compare months of work to a week in here.
This is a hypocritical and pointless debate. No one batted an eyelid all these years on various social media platforms. Now that we know how much an author makes from a payout we are compelled to raise a red flag? The real issue is within us and not the laws regarding content that is selected from various sources and shared on this platform with credit to the content owners. Everyone one from your basement blogger to the top news agencies on the web and print do it and yet because of this transparent system of Steemit we are pissed about how much similar content gets upvoted. Everyone of us thinks that our own content/photography/opinions is golden! It's time to wake up to the reality that it may not always be the case! If you feel that you are not being paid enough on Steemit to post/write/share/curate content I strongly suggest you to pitch your ideas in the traditional way to an editor of a paper/mag/website and learn how difficult it is to even earn a cent. Be grateful if you've made even a $.01 on Steemit and move on to the next blog post. If you think it's not worth your time, start a regular blog and learn to monetize it. You'll know in 1 hour how difficult it is. Live and let live and stop bashing each other. Use the time to create value that can be consumed and shared. :) Cheers.
That type of action (not yours) makes me really angry. I saw the down vote brigade hitting posts with nothing wrong with them this weekend other than they were high in the trending list. I also saw people referring to steemit as a Ponzi scheme.
I had enough and thought I needed to post something. It didn't get MUCH traction, but I still think it is relevant and it is my attempt to stop the same thing you were attempting to stop.
https://steemit.com/steemit/@dwinblood/not-a-ponzi-scheme-seems-like-a-new-paradigm-up-votes-regardless-of-topic-help-us-all
I am making a list of my own of people I see down voting posts that don't have anything unavoidably offensive, not plagiarizing other steemit users, etc.
Looking for patterns. I AM starting to see some.
EDIT: Also, I have noticed the weekend LACKS activity from of the high steem powered people. Often their votes negate these people improperly flagging posts. As my list is showing almost all of them are pretty low in the steem power. Lower than me, and my vote doesn't generally do much. So it only takes one vote from someone with good steem power to negate their effect. Sadly, the weekends are nowhere near as active with high steem powered people as during the week. Sunday's are particularly low.
Simple; the only way to let evil profit is to fail to vote in the November election.
The only way for terrorists to win is to give into their demands or act or react as they try and force youto do...
The only way for trolls to win is too respond norinteract with their demented flames...
Always avoid cancers like bigots, racists, trolls etc ; and surgically remove them from your life
"I did what I do out of love for photography and this project." - Then why do you care what others think, do, say, or how they act?
Trolls are starting to feed. You have my sympathy and my support. Also, the downvoting. What's with that? I wrote a solid post, did very well. A few hours before payout it got slammed with more than 20 downvotes. Not one of them commented or gave a reason for doing so. Knocked almost $3k off the reward. Why? What is with people? Can't they see this is a good thing for everyone? I don't understand.
Those people are jealous of people that have created successfull original posts and want to destroy the spirit of others so they can keep posting their crap. Some trolls here have bought big steem power to demolish steemit from inside.
You know, if I was Facebook or Reddit this wouldn't be a bad idea. It would be a very good idea, in the baddest way.
This is upsetting to read. But this is internet, it is a dark and nasty placed filled with terrible horrors.
I say just keep swimming man, don't let these idiots get to you.
I'm sorry you had that experience within this community. Being kind and and helping others is what makes this community special. Obviously the community has reached out in a monetary way for two reasons 1.) because we value you and 2.) without a positive reputation, steemit will crumble an become greedy. I think in this commuity it should be welcomed to share pictures and videos you have not created as long as you credit the author and people dont assume you created it. Just add your comments about what it means to you and why you shared it. Hope you stay here!
People really need to read the WhitePaper. Even if content isn't original and its copied from someone else is irrelevant. If you liked what you read or what you viewed, then this social platform is working. Almost everything posted on reddit is ReHashed from somewhere else.
You should just ignore jealous people. Steemit should give us option too set your wallet private. Don't give up brother! Fuck hater's.
I saw a lot post on bitcointalk and other forums about steemit ponzi or scam, but i dont believe it. We must make big,strong and helpful community.
But this is same in real life, when you reach goal people should be happy and try to make it too(they just need to work hard), but no they are just angry and jealous. They dont try to make own goal and this is biggest problem of jealous people.
i completely agree with you these people act as if the platform is their creation and that it is their money being used to vote on content they don't like.
Some even create accounts just so they can give out more down-votes on posts they think is making to much money.
Its ridiculous they have some vision in their head that they're imposing on everyone.
This platform is supposed to be free and there needs to be a wide diversity of content created, and shared from many different sources.
now that Steemit is hereI really don't have much interest in other social media sites i would rather stay right here on Steemit and if people share content from other places and people find value in it and vote that is their business and right to use their property in any way that they feel as long as they're are not trespassing on other rights.
But man dont leave dont let them win they are being evil dictators thinking justifying their action in the name of protecting Steemit.
We cant give in to their jealous intent .
We have to fight back till they stand down.
Haters gonna hate.. If your pissing people off, your probably doing something right!
Looks like the botwhales are extremely butthurt with the new hardfork that spoils their childish games. :D
They are flagging every bigmoney posts they possibly can for no other reason than being a pain in the ass.
As with anything that involves people, there will always be a few who feel the need to try to hammer their will onto others, And we all know how the interwebs work, the anonymity gives the unpowerful a large hammer.
Dear Masteryoda you are absolutely right. no one have right to flag your post with out any reason this is just right of STEEM officials so impressed with your work and also your thoughts best wishes for you don't leave the STEEM community as this is the platform where every one be survived.
Haters gonna hate, I'm ok with it as long as there is a source posted with it.
Success is always the envy of people who consider other people's money
It's all about timing I guess @masteryoda
Some people want to controll and decide what is the right to do or not, like everything in real-life, They're only concerned with themselves .
My friend steemit is still beta, which we have right now is patience and persistence, that over time the trolls will disappear, do not hate the steemit because she loves you and will make you very happy yet.
It's photo commentary and should be considered fair use @masteryoda. Don't stop what you are doing!
Stupid people are everywhere. The problem is that most of them try hard to look cool. This is not the case on the internet ! Being annonimous they feel free to say shit.
hey at least you're honest that takes courage. sorry this happened to you.