With InLeo's "successful" proposal for $180,000, I wanted to do some digging into what this looks like for Hive and how much of an impact it has. Considering they have another they put in for over $460,000 for 2025, it should be interesting. I noticed in their header above, they claim to have on-boarded with around 13,417 new MAU (monthly active users).
A recent quote from a video a couple days ago. "InLeo is starting to so much activity on the blockchain is filling up all the blocks on the blockchain".
For years it has been estimated Hive has around 5,000 to 20,000 active users. While this is a wide range, it's hard to be completely accurate as most users have 5-10 accounts.
The first thing I did was look at posts/comments over the last 12 months.
While there are peaks, the overall trend is fairly constant. The start and end are pretty much at the same place. For example in January 2024 we had an average of 2,639 posts/day and 21,177 comments/day. In January 2025, we had 2,798 posts/day and 23,389 comments/day.
If you fact in a few things going on, this is actually even less impressive. As many may know, Hive has had a flood of spam in the last few months with spammers making thousand accounts and copying old posts from the blockchain from other users and reposting them. There is another significant factor, but I will cover that in a bit.
I brought this up on the post announcing the new InLeo proposal and got this response.
Ok, let's look at threads. If you are not familiar with threads, they are basically comments in daily container posts to bring Twitter like activity to Hive.
These threads numbers are largely inflated by spam and AI bots being used to pad the numbers and improve SEO.
For example, if we break down the entire chain daily comments for a 30 day period and compare it to just one user, we can see this accounts for as much as 15% of the entire blockchains activity.
This is largely due to the pattern of posting random news shit a couple hundred times a day using AI, then having another AI bot follow up each of them with 10 ai generated summary comments.
You can see the pattern here:
These ai comments can post almost 10,000 comments a day. When I was looking into this, you can see the raw data here for the amount of comments/day just from the summaries.
Similar activity could be found on the defunct @leoglossary account which spammed ai wikipedia articles with heavily keyword stuffed articles to improve SEO. This in reality actually did quote the opposite for Hive and InLeo ironically.
While we might have 10,000 more active users, it is largely a handful of users I suspect. In the last 12 months, there are 916 accounts created by leo.voter that have more than 10 comments.
Honestly, I can go on and on, what's the fucking point since the proposal is pretty much funded.
Enjoy the sell pressure I guess.
Posted Using INLEO
This is why financialization is the enemy of socialization. Principles matter. There are not >10k new users of Hive. It is plainly obvious from @arcange's data. AI has enabled simulating users and this is being done to Hive.
IMG source - Peakd.com
Social media has become the largest financial sector in global markets in the last decade or so. This demonstrates that society, which is people, drives prosperity. Simulating society simulates prosperity. If you want to live in simulated prosperity, simulate society.
If you want people to prosper, prevent simulated socialization. Hive has embraced automating social interactions, and has utterly failed to prosper, to capture actual human users that have driven social interactions to dominate global financial markets. Society is comprised of people, and allowing social interactions to be simulated by automating them utterly destroys society - destroys people.
If Hive does not limit it's use to human beings, Hive will be destroyed because of it. Hive may be able to be a simulation of society running bots, but what use is that to people? Insofar as Hive advances automation of social interactions, it devalues Hive to people. That is what Leo is doing, because Leo can profit financially by pretending to be multiple people when it is actually running bots to simulate people. Eventually what will come of that is an absence of human people on Hive, and a bunch of simulations interacting, which will erase the value of Hive tokens and cause people to use actual social media where people interact with one another.
Infesting Hive with AI and bots is destroying Hive. It can be prevented, but it can only be prevented by enabling people to prosper, and DV's concentrate stake which prevents people from prospering and enables whales to control governance, which is what is happening to Hive today. As long as stake continues to be concentrated and governance controlled by whales, Hive will continue to decline in utility to people.
Thanks!
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There's one very key thing that this "LEO Uses AI" narrative is missing... Proof.
You guys are citing people on Hive who use INLEO and may use summarizers to add data and saying that its the INLEO team. None of the people you guys are citing are on the INLEO team.
It's funny that people buy into a narrative just because someone like Marky says its true. Doing 10 minutes of research will show you that he's just attributing something to LEO to shape his own narrative.
That's the real narrative.
No. The truth is that you didn't bring in any new users at all. When you do you'll add value to the Hive platform. Until you do, you'll simply mine Hive for ROI, and that's all you're really interested in.
The thousands of AI comments you pay Taskie to produce aren't just without value to Hive, they reduce the value of Hive to people. Society is people, and AI isn't people.
Bring in people, or continue to devalue Hive. It's that simple.
I appreciate this post and think it is important to look closely at metrics and ensure all funded projects are held accountable for their funding.
I’d be interested to hear InLeo’s response to your points. In my eyes, I see InLeo working hard for the chain. I see a lot of legwork on interoperability with other chains and big pushes in innovation regarding what InLeo offers. I know that beyond the DHF funding, they have invested a lot of their own money as well (which truly should be expected of all funded projects).
Honestly, I don’t use InLeo much, but I do see them as an asset to Hive. I guess the question is always: is this DHF investment also benefiting the entire community and not just the heads of whatever funded project?
As I say, I think it’s great that you are holding feet to the flame, as they say. It reminds me a bit of the good work @blanchy has done concerning the Value Plan.
I’m curious if you would indulge my query. I notice you often comment on or GIF Blanchy’s Value Plan posts but don’t upvote them. I often wonder why more of the bigger players are not holding the Value Plan’s feet to the flame in terms of transparency and metric analysis regarding the true benefit of the various projects.
(Perhaps there is some politics amongst the bigger hive players that I’m not aware of, as there seems to a lot of crickets besides smaller accounts)
I am in no way shitting on VP as a concept—many of the projects are clearly trying to bring value to the chain. However, I do think that more oversight and pressure from the community seem needed.
I don’t often see the voices that I think could have a greater influence on how VP funds are distributed and what expectations the community should have after those funds are received. Me and a handful of other smallish accounts comment, but I’m just one Butt. 🤓
I would if I upvoted anyone. I enjoy and appreciate his posts. I focus on reducing supply via burn posts.
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Oh that's very disappointing.
I did get a message from Khal asking me to support the new proposal - we had had a previous conversation where I'd explained why I wasn't supporting the last proposal. I've just responded today asking whether we know how many accounts were created through the Dash Partnership. Although it is a bit moot because, as I explained, I don't support proposals for apps which are private businesses (although I would like to know the account creation through the Dash Partnership, out of interest).
Khal says he is financing half of this proposal as some commenters had said it was too expensive; I can't see why he is not cutting back on the plans to what he can afford and financing it 100%.
When you deal with numbers you know that you can use the number for what purpose you want! It is very easy to do that! If they do a report citing promising users and showing their production at least 10!! It could be already a big deal!!!! So i challenge them to cite 10 users from these 10k that are publishing real content ( it doesn’t need to be a very goood content just real I ask)
Last month I checked the ~1500 'new users' Hive on Board claimed to have 'onboarded'. I checked a couple dozen of the accounts and one of them had any activity at all, indicating that all the rest were not actual humans eager to use their new accounts to post and comment on Hive, but merely accounts current users simply purchased and stockpiled for future use.
That one account immediately began posting and commenting on Vibes, which is one of the more financially profitable mechanisms enabling accumulation of Hive tokens potential to poorly staked accounts. This did not suggest a new user, fresh to Hive, but rather a sock of an established account seeking to mine Vibes for tokens. Hive on Board is just a mechanism afflicting Hive with bots. All 'Hive marketing' efforts appear to be the same. Valueplan is a plan without value. Nothing it has done has driven any substantial number of new users of Hive to join. Nothing it is planning to do will either. It's mining the DHF, and that's all it is.
There is only one meaningful marketing department on Hive, and it is the same on every social media platform in the world. It is people posting interesting content, happy they posted it on Hive. Upvoting interesting content will please the authors of that content, and people interested in it will find it, come to Hive, see that the creator of the content received money for posting it, and seek to join Hive to become that happy about posting here too.
Every DV destroys Hive marketing, and does little to discourage spam and scams. Creating some modest delegations to people that will upvote content is the best marketing plan that Hive could adopt, and nothing less will cause Hive to succeed. Stewards of Gondor was the optimum plan to enable Hive to succeed, and Valueplan is the worst strip mining of Hive for ROI since bidbots.
Enjoy watching Hive be destroyed by whales in front of our eyes, because that's what's happening.
You summarized well our current state of the blockchain! Well lets keep doing our best , what we thing is right for it! At least we will rest that we did the best that we could! That’s how I think right now! And of course showing the dirty is always good many people that weren’t unware will see it. And of course trying to find the small new users that are trying their best is the most important right now!
If we keep supporting actual people, we will survive the botters that will eventually fuck off, and then we'll be able to use the ability to support actual people to create a Hive social media platform that can capture the actual power of social media that demonstrably has rapidly become the largest sector of the global financial markets. Profiteers stand on execrable principles that actually deprive them of the most valuable and meaningful benefits people can attain. They cut their own throats by cheating and botting, devaluing themselves by doing so.
By standing firmly on sound principles advancing human felicity, people will eventually outcompete liars and cheats that cannot create solid foundations to support ongoing commerce.
It's easy when almost no one checks or even understands them.
Trust yet verify. But I tend to not trust, but verify.
if you can't verify, then you can't trust. but how would fake news survive if everyone verifies?
I can't imagine how hard it would be to to juggle so many accounts. Or why I would even want that many. I already spend my days creating art/gaming content for my 1 account. Managing to regularly post different content on 10 accounts seems completely insane to me.
You just automate them. You create a circlejerk of bots voting each the other, and mine Hive for tokens. It's all the rage in the most substantially staked circles. Hive is becoming a pure circle jerk of bots, that the whales are using to strip the rewards pool for ROI.
This plan is the death of Hive, because it eliminates actual human users, and it is human beings that comprise actual society that uses social media. Simulating society simulates prosperity, and the profiteers that do this will simulate wealth - and that is the opposite of having actual wealth.
That is a shame. I can see why someone would be tempted to do that from financial perspective. But that would take all the joy from making content...
Exactly. Human society is the real source of value of all commercial activity, and every trick or cheat fails to stand on a solid foundation that advances human society, and that will eventually outcompete commerce founded on flimsy tricks instead of advancing human felicity.
Always appreciate your thoughts, analyses, and perspective Marky.
With that said, when I look at what Khal and his team have done and are doing, I think we need more similar efforts, not fewer.
What Hive needs is value creators, not just content creators. And Khal and his team are working on creating value for others with everything they do. Obviously that means different things to different people. That’s why we need MORE teams doing the kinds of things Khal’s team is doing, imho.
I’m a huge fan of building and creating, but we need to be honest with reality.
Then you are a huge fan of INLEO as we are building and creating multi-chain technology for Hive that this chain has only dreamed would be possible. Thank you for your support.
Stop slandering us and try having a productive conversation about how we can continue to add more Hivers to Hive.
As far as I can see, INLEO is doing everything in our power on a daily basis to add more Hivers through our Dash partnership and soon with the other 10 partnerships that our DHF proposal will make possible.
If you have constructive feedback about the next 10 to come (since it is going to happen), I am all ears.
I am 1000% for the creation of new features and apps, and applaud many things you have done, but the end result is a very different story.
Slander implies lying or stating false facts, I provide data and proof and don't just make up numbers or say random things. The word you are thinking about is libel, as is it in writing.
Your "data" is citing a user's activity to comply with your narrative. This has nothing to do with the INLEO team
It has to do with the metrics, and even if you ignore this, the overall metrics show there is not 13,614 monthly active users in growth. Our growth has been pretty much flatline, and that's with your "amazing growth" and the onslaught of AI spam by taskmaster, and the onslaught of spam from spam farms that have cropped up in the last few months, meaning we have actually declined but you can't see it as all this has basically brought it up to about where we were a year ago.
Everything I have stated is backed up by cold hard facts easily provably at the blockchain level with zero bias and spin.
Of course we need to be honest with reality.
The reality I see is that Khal and Eric and their team are building bridges from Hive to lots of other tech and other potential builders, investors, etc.
I’d like to see 10 more teams that are similarly motivated and similarly trying new things. Economic growth is driven by entrepreneurial activity. Entrepreneurial activity is by definition mired in the depths of uncertainty. Most will fail, some will succeed. A rare few will succeed spectacularly. We need one or two of those rare few here on Hive. To get those rare few requires a wide net and lots of failures and modest successes along the way.
I have no complaints about that.
I said elsewhere, I'd love 100 leos, not 0 or 1. We need far more projects on Hive not less.
We need a new decision-making procedure for the DHF.
From Day 1 I’ve been dismayed by how centralized the Decentralized Hive Fund is.
Any time you have a “Yes” or “No” decision being made by a single group, no matter how large or small the group, that’s not decentralized decision making. DHF should be funded more like KickStarter, imho. Let everyone vote for the projects they want to see funded and once a project has enough support, it can move forward.
Obviously this has the potential for self-vote and circle-vote abuse, so anti-abuse protections would be needed.
One way to handle that would be to have each proposed project have an appointed overseer who is not a member of the project team, who is perhaps randomly assigned from a pool of approved candidates, who gets paid a percentage fee to financially oversee the project.
Or, projects get voted on first, then a competitive process is used to determine who gets paid to execute the project.
The solution is for more people to have stake.
His main argument is pointing to community members of Hive and attributing their actions to the INLEO team and that we are "padding our numbers"
The funniest part is that this has nothing to do with our team, he's just assigning the narrative he wants to push.
INLEO has continued to innovate and build our platform in a way to outwardly attract new Hivers. He can shape whatever narrative he wants but any Hiver who wants to see the truth can just look at the INLEO Platform, our partnership with Dash and our upcoming partnerships with many other ecosystems.
We'll keep working our asses off to grow Hive. Mark can keep shouting on his soapbox.
Your metrics are "threads numbers", these activities directly inflate these metrics by such a large and drastic amount. Regardless of if it is your directive, it is still the case. 15% of the entire chain activity by one user which directly goes to your metric is not an abnormally you can ignore.
Regardless, it's a moot point as the overall stats show nothing has really changed, it's just a subsection of nonsense that should be address. Yet Hive Watchers continues to ignores, yet downvotes people using ai on a much smaller level for pennies. Whole different problem, interesting regardless.
I'd like to hear the answer themarkymark - (but I like the hype)
https://peakd.com/hive/@themarkymark/re-khaleelkazi-sr2g92
Haha - actually I'm watching Game of Colmar 2, episode 3 right now and I don't feel like writing at all, but I'll try to be brief:
Regarding the number of accounts (I've been on Hive for seven years, I'm not very active, but I'm here 360 days a year - morning, afternoon, evening, and even now at night) I don't see an increase in accounts.
But I see a bunch of accounts that unreasonably receive big rewards. I see good accounts with meager rewards.
I can go on forever - but I'd better finish watching The Squid Game and go to bed. Otherwise I might have a nervous breakdown like @acesontop wrote today!
I am as transparent as you get. When I say things I review and provide actual data rather than just say things that make me happy. It’s all easily verifiable with moderate skillset.
I already found an inaccuracy in the first sentence of your post, Mark.
Innacurate and outdated.
Also wrong as we filter out known bot activity and have specific filters for doing so. Also, you continue to claim that we use this activity to pad our numbers while quoting activity from the community members who experiment with AI to summarize content and bring data to Hive. Also wrong. This has nothing to do with the INLEO team so thank you for attaching our name to something that has nothing to do with us as well.
You can go on and on because it's the only thing you do on Hive. We're all well aware that you are both:
You've made both positions very clear and I've also made it clear I'm done interacting with someone who only does things to make Hive look bad and fail. While you do this, the rest of us will make Hive succeed. Hopefully all of your Hive stake will be sold off before the rest of us make Hive successful.
You can continue to slander us but notice how everyone else is not siding with your narrative.
It's accurate, it is what you put in for, yes you changed it because it wasn't going to get apprroved.
I've only recently sold hive in ~8 years and I still have more than you, but I'll pretend you haven't been selling for ages. :strawman:
I don't hate Leo, and I want it to succeed, I want 100 leos. What I don't want is bullshit.
It's inaccurate as many of your statements are. Clicking a link will show people how inaccurate it is, but nice try.
You don't have more than me on my other accounts, but sure push that false narrative too.
We continue to innovate and do everything in our power to bring in Hivers every day. That is the only narrative I care about and I will push out 10 more tech stacks & campaigns like "Join INLEO, Earn Dash" with Solana, Arbitrum, ChainFlip, ChainLink and many others which will bring in a new wave of adoption to Hive.
You can sit back and keep talking shit, you can give me some actual usable feedback. It doesn't matter. I will do this regardless.
As always, I'm open to constructive and useful feedback and closed to nonsense.
As many things in this post, Marky’s statement is inaccurate. We’re not asking to $460k. The ask is ~$230k. I will be matching it with my own funds to get to $460k we need for these 10 partnerships
Please read the actual docs we posted and not Marky’s lies: https://peakd.com/me/proposals/332
You did initially ask for $460k but changed it because you realized it wasn't going to happen. Turn off the reality distortion field and talk honestly.
Hi, I hope to be among the active users who comment without using "AI", nice post my friend.👍👍👍